Topic : 06/06 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Please come back to this topic in ten years and let us know how your friend is doing. That is if he is still sane or alive.  

One can turn their back on their true selves for only so long and then the pain manifests itself in all sort of illnesses including depression. I know first hand because I was married to two men for twenty years and hid the fact that I am gay until I was 47. When I finally came out it was like coming Home and I felt normal for the first time in my life. And I was celibate too. For awhile until I was ready. 

I wish for your friend the joy and luck that he find a man to love who shares his beliefs and that they have a child together to love, praise and raise to be a kind human being. It happens all the time and I hope it happens for him! 

You are either homosexual, heterosexual or bi-sexual. These are not choices but inherent psycho-sexual traits. The vast MAJORITY of medical professionals and mainstream research agrees that this trait is determined VERY early in a child's development, possibly even before birth and it does have a strong biological component to it. 

Dr. Phil also stated this on MANY occasions on his shows and he represents what the recognized and professional mainstream scientists have to say on the matter. For more information you can go to objective, mainstream sties like the American Psychological Association www.apa.org for information. Just search, "Homosexuality". 

During the show Dr. Phil made a CLEAR distinction between homosexual ORIENTATION and homosexual BEHAVIOR. There is of yet NO emperical and conclusive evidence that ANY therapy programme has changed an independently confirmed homosexual into a indepenedently confirmed heterosexual.  All these ex-gay programmes do is try to change BEHAVIOR. Most people who identify as ex-gay say that they STILL are attracted to people of the same sex, they just do not act on it, this even applies to those who now display heterosexual behavior. As a straight person think of it in the REVERSE. Imagine you have to ACT GAY but you are still instinctively attracted to the opposite sex. 

Being gay is not a behavior. It is not a lifetyle choice. There is no ONE behavior that determines whether someone is gay or not. You can be gay and celibate, gay and a virgin, gay and married to someone of the opposite sex, gay and single, gay and promiscuous, gay and in a monogamous committed relationship with someone of the same sex etc. Having sex with people of the same gender does not necessarily mean you are a homosexual. Lots of STRAIGHT people engage in homosexual sex for many reasons- money (as in porn stars or prostitutes) or in prison (desperation or survival). It does not mean they are gay. WHY? Because this is NOT THEIR INHERENT SEXUAL ORIENTATION. Under normal circumstances they would instinctively be attracted to people of the opposite sex.  

So what makes a gay person gay? Simple. Their natural inclination is to be instinctively attracted to people of the same sex NOT the opposite sex. As my gay male friend would put it, "Halle Berry herself could strip naked and give me a lapdance and NOTHING will be happening.". They simply DO NOT FEEL ANYTHING SEXUAL FOR THE OPPOSITE SEX  just as we who are straight simply DO NOT FEEL ANYTHING for people of the same sex. I know cannot help being straight. It was not a choice, it just comes naturally to me, if I were to force myself to be with someone of the same sex it would gross me out and feel unnatural. For gay people, it is the opposite and people should try to show a little bit more empathy and understanding instead of spouting nonsense just because it sounds good to them. 

I am always interested in hearing what others have to say on any give issue that interests me. As a gay man, the 10-19-05 episode of the Dr. Phil show peaked my interest. Whenever this, or any other issue is spoken about, people seem to forget that we are all children of God who are made uniquely from one another. This means that we will have differing views because we bring our uniqeness to the table of discussion. We fail to also keep in mind that what one person knows intellecually and the things he/she has read, the person on the opposite side has not read nor knows intellectually. We all have our experiences and I think we should respect one another's experience. In regards to the episode, a guy named David (the priest) says that he was in the gay lifestyle. He was a prostitue. He now considers himself heterosexual, but he never answered Dr. Phil's question of whether or not his orientation ever changed as opposed to his behavior changing. Note: because he had sex with males does not mean he was gay. Engaging in the sex act does not mean those engaging in the act are gay. It is my belief, based on David's story as shown on the show, that he was never gay. Just having gay sex. There's a difference. It is also my belief that those who have these "cures" from homosexuality were never gay. That is, as a matter of the heart as opposed to the behavior. Let's face it, someone can be heterosexual, decide to be celibate or a virgin and STILL be heterosexual. Why would that not apply to a homosexual? There are many gay persons who, like Justin (bald guy in episode) who have gone through what David went through and more who STILL are gay. Some may attribute this to the individual's inability to want to change, but who's to say they can know someone's level of desire to change or want to change? No one really can. Read Justin's response to the episode that he was on here: http://www.gaychristian.net/drphil_response.php The show was edited, so the other things said were not all included in the episode. For all of you who oppose gay relationships on a biblical basis, read carefully what Justin has to say in his response. There are many persons who love God and seek God who do not see things as you who oppose this issue do. It's not a matter of denying the "Word of God" as some of you call it. It's about whose interpretation of that "Word" is correct? I ask you this, "Why should I take my beliefs, my faith, my conclusions, interpretations, etc. and set them aside and live my life according to yours?" 

Watching David go on TV made me feel very bad for him and the fact that he can't accept his sexulity and will probably never be in a loving relationship. I also feel bad for any homosexuals who are dealing with the pain of coming out, and had to hear him tell them they can change.
 Being  gay, there are two things that set me off. First, when people assume male on male pedophiles are "gay". Second, when people say I chose to be gay. 

For anyone who thinks that homosexuality is a  choice,  when did you make the conscious decision to me straight? Did you get up one morning when you were 5, know the real societal differences between being straight/gay, and make an informed choice what to be straight? Please tell me the time in your life you made the decision to be straight and the consequences you weighed to make the decision. 

I never said at 7-10 year old "Hmm, the world has two different sexualities, gay and straight. and now I have to make a decision" and chose gay. I did things labled as "gay" since before I was even in pre-school. Also remember  that kids can't think in abstract terms like "gay" so the idea of a kid choosing is ridiculous. In fact, during the toddler to pre-pubescent stages of child development a child thinks in terms of "me, me, me". Their brains have not developed to the point where they can reason with abstract terms or understand homosexuality on a societal level. Since parents pick up all types of signs that children are gay  from when they are young, you can't tell me a kid whose brain hasn't developed made a concious decision to be gay. 

If you can choose to be straight and gay at will, tell me if you force your thought pattersns to be sexually attracted to the same sex, fall in love with a person of the same sex,, and want to spend life with a man. You can't tell me you wouldn't have some problem. Think about how fake it would be and how much of a lie it would be, if you forced yourself to "fall inlove" with a same sex person and get married when you aren't sexually attracted to. If you think it's so easy to change your sexual attraction I want you to fall in love with a rock and get married with it and have a real emotional bond with it. 

Finally, if being gay was a choice why would anyone consciously choose a lifestyle  with a large amount of negative repercussions? Homosexuals are more likely to be the target of hate crimes, more likely to abuse alcohol l because of depression/feeling isolated, more likely to abuse drugs because of depression/feeling isolated, more likely to commit suicide, are labeled "sinners" by main stream religions, are not fully socially accepted yet, are sometimes isolated from their families, don't get marriage benefits,  and are not yet federaly  protected from being fired because of their sexuality. Anyone who would choose a life with as many negative aspects as opposd to a heterosexual one would have to be insane. If you talked to many homosexuals, most have them have lived most of their teenage years trying anything to be straight but find it's just impossible to love and be attracted to the opposite sex 

 Concerning conversion therapies, they do not work and are not  recommended by the APA. In studies they have been shown to not be effective and that it actually causes long term damage and identity problems. Anyone who said they "converted to being straight" with the help of god, is lying and unfortunately very confused. Most of the time, even though the person still is not physcially attracted to the opposite sex, they will lie to themselves and do heterosexual behaviors to convince themselves they are straight.  When you look at most of the people who do this, they are usually have very conservative religious families who would rather lose a relationship with thier kids before accepting homosexuality. They also usually have the belief they are going to hell to burn in eternal damnation, which is a complete falacy, if they accept their sexuality.  I have yet to meat a person who is "turned straight" and came from a non-relgious family with liberal parents who support them and who don't believe in hell.   

I hate seeing homosexuals who they are forced "straight" down the road when they married, have chiledren, and eventually have a crisis and abandan the famly causing more harm then good. The homosexual suicide rate is almost much more higher then the heterosexual one because of things like this. 

To David, I would also like to know where he got his statistical evidence that homosexuality is a result of childhood trauma. I know hundreds of homosexuals who all have had wonderful stable upbringings. 

it would be nice if people like you thought a bit but then you are the heterosexual privelaged free person so you dont need to think. its all laid out for you. if i was not in a hurry i would lay it all out for you like how churches and other groups attack gays all the time. individuals attack gays. they are obsessed with the subject of homosexuality. it is a taboo.if it werent a taboo people wouldnt talk about it. it needs to be so out there that it becomes accepted.we(gays)have everything straight life shoved in our faces all the time and everywhere. you dont see it because you are so used to having that privelage of being hetero. it makes me mad how ignorant so many people are. but then again i am happy that you voiced your opinion.also, gay people are no more and i think less likely to be pedophile.its a predominantly hetero thing.