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Topic : 06/21 "Throw It Out!"

Number of Replies: 359
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Created on : Friday, January 27, 2006, 02:40:01 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Air Date: 02/01/06) Do you know someone who can't seem to get rid of their clutter? They keep newspapers, magazines, old clothes, and just plain junk thinking it will come in handy one day. Dr. Phil talks to extreme hoarders, who are embarrassing their families and destroying their homes. Nancy says her husband, John, is a packrat who turned their beautiful four-bedroom home into what she calls "the black hole." The house became so overcrowded with junk that they were forced to live in a trailer, and now the trailer is nearly filled to the brim! Will John and Nancy ever be able to live in their house again? And how is John's hoarding affecting their three children? Then, Misty saves every piece of paper her kids write on, and every article of clothing they've ever worn. Her husband, Greg, can't understand why she can't just toss them out. What's behind her inability to throw things away? Share your stories, join the discussion.

 

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frustrated
June 18, 2006, 2:35 pm PDT

We need help!

My sister and I are at the end of the rope and the knot is slipping out! Our mother is a hoarder. She is 87 and her house was condemned because of the state of it. There was no way to walk into her house without walking on STUFF. You could not have died and fallen down in there. She was sleeping in her car (also full to the top) because she couldn't live in there. Now she is in an apartment and has done the same thing. She saves everything she touches and keeps on buying more. I cannot get into her apartment because even the area around the door is stacked up. She has several garage sized storage rooms full to the top. She says that if she could just move to a larger place it would be OK and I reminded her that she had done it to a beautiful house. She is living without heat or air conditioning because no one can get in to make repairs. The toilet is broken. There is no water in the kitchen. And she keeps bringing in more! She has asked us to help her and we have both tried desperately to do so. My daughters have tried. She can't let go of anything, not even styrofoam take-out trays or plastic grocery bags. She seems to put the same value on an old yellow-pages book as she does to a string of pearls. Away from her surroundings she is as normal as cornbread, unless she stays there for 2 days. 25 years ago I threw away a sack of rusted cans that had started to crumble. She is still talking about it. My sister lives on one ocean and I live on the other. Mama is in between and we visit as often as possible. We were there last month and my sister tried to get Mama to let her clean out her car. There was food and trash in it and it was full of bugs. Mama refused because these were things that should go to the recycle bins and my sister didn't have the time to take them. She also did not want to get into a vehicle full of bugs. Can anyone tell me what they did in a situation like this?
 
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June 18, 2006, 4:50 pm PDT

American's are too Wasteful

I only throw things away once they have no more use left.   I refuse cardboard food boxes as microwavable paper plates or use them for art projects.  When my flowers on my porch dry up I turn them into a dye that can be used as paint.   I have often found that old clothes often come back into fashion.   I don't buy a lot and don't need to because I save things.  My apartment isn't cluttered full of things.   I don't see the point in throwing things away just because you don't like them anymore.  If nothing else give them to someone who can use them or have a yard sale.   It is amazing the stuff people throw away.  I pulled one of my current favorite CD's out of the trash that a former roomate was throwing away.   My toaster was also a giveaway that someone did not want, so are a number of my books, and some of my cooking stuff (from a table we had in my old apartment building with things people no longer wanted).  
 
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June 18, 2006, 6:15 pm PDT

Its inherited in many families. It goes back to depression times when people were out of work and there was no welfare or work to be had. Both of my parents came from a family with a dozen people in each family trying to survive with very little. I us

Quote From: tiggerluvr

I believe I'm probably part of this club - the "don't know where to put it, can't throw it out, piles in each room of the house" club.....my mother & two of my sisters are the same way.  I try to be organized; I help everyone else be organized, but when it comes to me, it's hard.  I'll start to go through things/papers/items/boxes from the '80's (not really from the '80's -haha), but then I'll either get distracted with my children or I'll have some things I really do want to keep & start to put them in their proper places; this too is part of the hoarding problem because you begin to go through things & accumulate a mound of things you are chucking & a mound you are keeping; the "keeping pile" then becomes your new hoarding pile - it might get put away, it might not; you might go through that box/pile of stuff you're keeping to get something out, but there it sits.....waiting....to find its real home.  There was one time in my life when I wasn't a hoarder - one of my older sisters helped me move into a new townhouse - my first with my son (single mom); I moved in on Friday night, mostly Saturday morning & by Sunday evening, everything was unpacked & put away - EVERYTHING!!!!! And I had a lot of stuff (about the second to largest Uhaul truck available) - being a hoarder.  As a box was empty, it got broken down & thrown into the dumpster.  No trash at all; no left-overs; things were even hung on the walls...dishes away...clothes hung....knick-knacks placed....it was lovely!  I kept that house in that order; I was allowed one medium size basket as a catch-all for my keys & mail - but I didn't let that pile up either!!!  Unfortunately, I've moved a few times since then and I still have boxes from times I've moved before that were still packed.  I do not know why I do this - maybe from my mother (but I really can't stand to go to her house because of her hoarding - mine is nowhere near her level); maybe because of my father's death; maybe because I have OCD; maybe because I have trouble letting go; maybe I'm afraid to finish something I start; maybe I feel overwhelmed when it comes to sorting & chucking; maybe I'm just lazy......I have vowed to work on a little each day, one room at a time, hoping it will eventually get done.  I wish I had the motivation of my older sister - just do it 'til it's done, no matter how long it takes.  In the meantime, I'll watch, read, & pray for my little miracle..............Blessings to all.....
 
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June 18, 2006, 6:29 pm PDT

Not everything is a antique of value no matter how old it is. My granddaughters husband looks for old Ball jars to keep as antiques but, he does use them for a drinking glass. Now me I have quite a few of those jars some blue and some clear and frankly

Quote From: alexis7

The only problem is that she and her family have spent untold money on building, adding on areas to their home just to store all these "treasures" to the point of insanity! Our family was raised in the house and 7 kids and 2 parents lived comfortably where now 4 people can barely move.
 
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June 19, 2006, 4:56 pm PDT

Getting Started!

Quote From: karen8363

Dear Dr Phil, I don't know why but when have cludder in my apartment I feel safer some how.  I feel protected.  Can't invite people over not that i would put i would like the option.  I have a phyical disability that limits how long i can clean.  I have to do a few mins and then have to stop because of the pain.  And once i stop it hard to start again.   Please HELP!!! 

I empahize with you. Thanks for this message.   

  

Yes, having a cluttered life is a somewhat reassuring thing. We ("clutterbugs") don't really see what others see, however. If there isn't space for others to visit, then you need to make space, and your work is cut out for you. 

  

Since it's difficult for you to move things, I suggest contacting someone (a friend or relative) who has the time and physical ability, to help you get started. If you are able, hire someone who cleans houses.  

  

Before the helpers come over, get the items ready--mark the piles you know something about, and take colored tape, one color "toss," and the other "save." The heavier, neglected stuff, you might wait until "company" arrives, to help you lift piles and sort.  

  

Since you're not too specific about the amount of clutter, nor am I familiar with you personally, I won't make further suggestions, other than begin by stopping the collecting. The less you bring (or allow others to bring) into the apartment, the less likely you are to be messy.  Bring in only things that are useful (such as a telephone, TV, or sofa), necessary for life (such as food, clothing, etc.), or brings you true joy and comfort (such as family photo albums). 

  

My guess is that you might want to confide further about your "hiding" behind the clutter, with a therapist or a clergy person. Some rhetorical questions (just think about these questions): What are you hiding from? What are you afraid your visitors will find? Is your disability obvious, and are you self-conscious about the obvious attributes?  

  

As a pack rat who is going through his old things right now, I can say stripping away the clutter helps me be clear about me. My things aren't "me". I can live pretty much without things other than  just the simple things, like clothes, this computer, and my TV.  

  

My first question, when I look at the items on a heap: what items will I use in the next five years? Will I miss not having this item? What value do I have for this item? Can I seriously live without having several copies of the same magazine or newspaper, or more than five identical pens?  

  

The positive thing about your note is that you're taking the first step--acknowledgement of the problem and seeing what you have, is quite helpful in getting started. Your next step is to stop the inflow, and decrease what you can, that's keeping visitors away.   

  

One other thing that I empathize with--I had two back surgeries, and I'm recovering from a broken ankle. I take my time, I lift only what I can, or I break down the stacks into smaller,  lighter piles, so that I can move things on my own. I use wheels--dollies and other carts that roll freely. I also take time out when the pain levels are too high. But I keep working at making my space neater, moreso organized, and inviting to friends and others who I want to see the space. I have friends who understand what I'm doing, who can help me move heavy things.   

  

Keep us appraised of your progress.  

 
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June 19, 2006, 5:11 pm PDT

One Dumpster

Quote From: richs54

Last fall I rented a dumpster to clean out my garage. I filled it full, and could hardly believe it. But, even then my house is still cluttered up, as I "may need it one day".,  Help!

Wow--I hope the next dumpster is one construction crews use, when tearing out walls and roofs from buildings!  

   

What is guiding your need to keep things? Think about this. I have a clutter problem, that might be rooted many years ago, when my grandparents saved nearly every scrap of paper!  

   

The question I ask when I look at an item on my "collection pile:" Will I really use this item in the next 5 years?" Has this item occupied my home for the last 5 years without ues? The only things that I can hold onto are items that I need, or that truly bring me joy. Items I've ignored for many years don't bring me joy, nor are they obviously useful.  

   

I hope this is helpful.   

 
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June 19, 2006, 5:32 pm PDT

Too Much Space

Quote From: lisas08


HELP I am going crazy,
no you don't understand I am really going crazy.
I am going nuts so bad that I put my self in a depressing state. every time I look at my House.
MY Husband is the biggest packrat. Not as bad as the man that had to move out of his house but I think that next.
We live in a 26000 house and it is packed we have 2 storage units one with a loft that is packed to the top.
He is Turing my kids in to packrats too.
I try to throw a way school work and my kids say Mom that is going to be worth money one day we need to save all of our school work. every thing is going to be worth money
My kids are 9 and 7  What do I do????
I always close the blinds in the house so no one can see in. I think we have a garage but I cant find it.
is driving me nuts.
I am no angel but I don't keep my 501 Levi's from 1986 NO Joke!!! or the wheels and tiers from my first car from the 80's if you wish I will try to find 1 of our 10 video creamers to show you. yep that right he keeps buying things because he cant find things that we all ready have.
some times we get in to big fights for 2 to 3 days over this.
 just yesterday My Kids wanted to ride there bikes so I spent 1 hr 1/2 digging them out of the garage I think its a garage and all this stuff fell down on me I don't know where it came from. My Husband tooled me that I better clean it up. or has going to be pissed at me. I said be pissed and me then, I don't care I am not going to clean it! No Now No how. so I guess he mad at me.
Hmm I guess it going to be quite a round here. My Kids cant go get there toys out of the garage because they will get hurt or get killed. all of there friends stay 2 feet a way from the garage just in case something falls.
Help me before I go to a padded room!!!! Please please.
Lisa

I don't know anything about you or your husband, Lisa. I think the piles of things are indicative of deeper-rooted problems that you might consider confiding to a therapist or a clergy person.  

   

There are several issues your husband and you might need to think about: Is homeowner's insurance difficult to procure, or high in price, in your neighborhood? Do you live in a known earthquake, tornado, or other natural disaster zone? Are the things in storage and in your house difficult for a firefighter to do his duty, if you need emergency services? If all of the answers are "Yes," then you will need to go to work on reducing the clutter.  

   

Although you might think the clutter is something that will "stay in the family," it probably is noticed by others, such as neighbors, and people like postal delivery persons and others who come uninvited, but on duty. If a disaster hits your house, it could be costly to your neighbors, in terms of increased home owner's insurance, or having the wind lift the roof off, and everything in your house or storage is scattered on a neighbor's lawn.  

   

I realize the disaster possiblity is low on your priority list, but it really needs to be moved up several notches.  

   

I empathise with you. Keep us appraised of your progress.  

   

   

 
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frustrated
June 19, 2006, 10:49 pm PDT

I feel ya

Quote From: mohabee96

I don't know anything about you or your husband, Lisa. I think the piles of things are indicative of deeper-rooted problems that you might consider confiding to a therapist or a clergy person.  

   

There are several issues your husband and you might need to think about: Is homeowner's insurance difficult to procure, or high in price, in your neighborhood? Do you live in a known earthquake, tornado, or other natural disaster zone? Are the things in storage and in your house difficult for a firefighter to do his duty, if you need emergency services? If all of the answers are "Yes," then you will need to go to work on reducing the clutter.  

   

Although you might think the clutter is something that will "stay in the family," it probably is noticed by others, such as neighbors, and people like postal delivery persons and others who come uninvited, but on duty. If a disaster hits your house, it could be costly to your neighbors, in terms of increased home owner's insurance, or having the wind lift the roof off, and everything in your house or storage is scattered on a neighbor's lawn.  

   

I realize the disaster possiblity is low on your priority list, but it really needs to be moved up several notches.  

   

I empathise with you. Keep us appraised of your progress.  

   

   

I too am a "Hoarder".. I hate it.. I can not throw anything away.."what if I need it", "what if someone needs it", "I can fix it". My husband hates it... He gets to the point he gets so mad at me.. I can not help it. I tell him if he threw the stuff away i would not even notice.. Of course he does not hate it that much.I drive myself crazy with this. I spend many many hours trying to organize or get rid or junk. I think i make it worse.. HELP!!!!
 

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upset
June 20, 2006, 12:34 pm PDT

GET RID OF IT

 My husband is a pack rat. When we were living in a 3 bedroom ranch home with a full basement he had junk all over the place. He has computers that are over 10 years old, but he believes that he can make money off of them. I keep telling him that they are way to slow, but he is deaf when I say to get rid of it. One of his friends tried to convince me why people like them need to save everything they buy or find. I told them both that they need to see a psychiatrist for this. They got mad at me - boo hoo. Me husband said that I broke him of picking up things off the curb ( it's only because we do NOT have the space for anything else in our 1 bedroom apt.), SHOCKING!!! Now all I need it him to get rid of the junk he already has, that will make me very happy.
 
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June 20, 2006, 7:36 pm PDT

Terminology 101: Hoarders, packrats, and clutterbugs

Hi Everybody!  

  

I've been looking through the many messages about being one who collects useless items, or about one who does so to prevent others from having something, or someone who is simply messy. I call them, respectively, "clutter bugs," "hoarders," and "packrats."  

  

"Hoarder" seems to describe someone who collects and keeps many things, but is doing this to prevent others from collecting the same things. In other words, a "hoarder" is one with selfish intentions. An instance I can think of is on Ebay--some collectors rally for an obsolete  item, and then proceed to outbid others, to claim the "prize." Unfortunately, the hoarder already has several identical items! Most hoarders boast about their collections, which are sometimes simply a waste of time to begin with, and really shows no joy or enthusiasm about the collection.  

  

"Packrat" seems to describe someone who is plain messy--no observable order. Dirty pots and pans remain on the stove, and in the sink for days, for instance. A real packrat lives out here in the Mojave Desert. It is a rodent that makes a nest out of sticks, discarded trash from it's human counterparts, and sometimes other animal nest parts! Ironically, the real pack rat is orderly, and like all non-human animals, driven by instinct and limited intelligence.  

  

"Clutter bug" seems to indicate someone who is obsessed with clutter to the point of being blind to both the possibility of disaster, and the possibility of danger to him or herself and their families. We see many news accounts of someone's home being destroyed by fire, but the firefighters can't get inside, because of the piles and piles of stacked newspapers, or other things. Sadly, this really makes life difficult, not only for the clutter bug, but also for the neighborhood, since homeowner insurance rates get higher, or it is unobtainable, due to one or two households in the same neighborhood, that are truly "junky."  

  

Now, I think that one can have the qualities of one, or any of the above attributes. One can manage to have all three potentially destructive attributes, too.  

  

I want to acknowledge true collectors. A true collector has a passion for what he or she is collecting. There is joy when a collector shows a friend or trusted visitor, the collection. A true collection is fully documented, and responsibility for obligations, such as licensure, or insurance for rare items, is paid by the true collector.  

  

I know several antique automobile "nuts." One has a vast warehouse, where his old cars are parked neatly, bumper to bumper. He hires a mechanic, who has a shop near the warehouse, and "new" cars that are added to the collection can be inspected and repaired as needed. I think "Rudy" is a passionate antique car collector.  All of the cars are registered to the state they are stored in, and he has insurance coverage on each vehicle. Rudy showed me his database, which not only lists the make, model, and date of manufacture of each car, but he hired a photographer to take pictures of the cars, too.  

  

In contrast to this orderly collection, "Ed" is a hoarder, and borderline clutter bug. His old cars are in disrepair, and stand, sadly, in the wind and heat of the desert, outside. His inability to repair or manage time to work on these old cars, makes for a potentially dangerous situation, since oil leaks into the soil, and one is not certain if the leak comes from the oil pan, at the engine, or is gasoline, from the gas tank. He buys dilapidated cars, despite the fact that he really can't afford to repair them, or register the license plates, or even bring them up to near the level that Rudy brings his cars. Ed not only hoards cars, that Rudy or his counterparts, could buy, but the space the cars occupy, and the sorry state of the soil under the cars, could serve a better purpose. Ed shows no joy in collecting cars, but claims that someday, the value of these vehicles will increase, despite the bumps, dents, and leaks.  

  

I'd like to hear feedback about my definitions of the common terms that people call themselves, under the "throw it out" banner.  

  

Best wishes!  

  

Mohabee  

 
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