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Messages By: charlie75

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January 5, 2006, 4:08 pm PST

Spirits, strongholds and curses

 In the psychiatric world, Malignant Narcissists the term I would use to describe my Mother's condition, but in the realm i of spiritual acknowledgement, it would be called the spirit of Jezebel.  Regardless of what this condition is called, my mother operates in a very inhumane, selfish, undeniably unremorseful, manipulative and corrupt manner.  She is a distructive person and is much like an emotional vampire.  Possesed by Jezebel or personality disorder.... both the same to me.

My question is open to not only Dr. Phil, but anyone else who may want to shed light or their opinion.  Does anyone have any knoweledge or hands on experiance being raised by a narcissistic parent?  I am now thirty and have my own family, but the web my mother has had the power of creating is not easily dismissed or escapable.  Much damage has been done emotionally and physically to those she's fed upon.  Am I alone?
 
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January 5, 2006, 4:11 pm PST

Spirits, strongholds and curses

 In the psychiatric world, Malignant Narcissists the term I would use to describe my Mother's condition, but in the realm i of spiritual acknowledgement, it would be called the spirit of Jezebel.  Regardless of what this condition is called, my mother operates in a very inhumane, selfish, undeniably unremorseful, manipulative and corrupt manner.  She is a distructive person and is much like an emotional vampire.  Possesed by Jezebel or personality disorder.... both the same to me.

My question is open to not only Dr. Phil, but anyone else who may want to shed light or their opinion.  Does anyone have any knoweledge or hands on experiance being raised by a narcissistic parent?  I am now thirty and have my own family, but the web my mother has had the power of creating is not easily dismissed or escapable.  Much damage has been done emotionally and physically to those she's fed upon.  Am I alone?
 
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January 5, 2006, 8:46 pm PST

you heard me! :)

Quote From: liatsunami

 I am so sorry you had to be raised by someone with this very serious disorder.  A freind of mine who has a B.A. in psychology  and I discussed this disease at great length.  Unfortuantely, narcissism is one of the most difficult personality disorders to correct, because the person can NOT by virtue of the disease acknowledge they have a problem, and treatment  and therapy often doesn't work.  I imagine your life with your mother must have been very difficult growing up, and you probably are very drained, hurt, and emotionally scarred from it. 

First, you have to accept there is NOTHING you can do to help your mother. Second, I would suggest going to a therapist that you can get comfortable enough with to discuss specific concerns relating to how this is affecting your life.   Get help by learning the steps you need to take to begin to give yourself control over your life and feelings.  Really listen to what the therapist tells you, and don't let him/her dismiss your feelings.

This disease is not your mother's fault, but you can't let her drag you down.  You really need to see a professional about how to free yourself from the trap you feel you're in.


 Wow, thank you so much for responding and for being someone who knows what I'm talking about!  I was really afraid that someone would reply and not quite get what I was referring to. 

It has been an aweful road, terribly aweful.  I've been like this pawn intentionally brought into this world for her to feed off of.  She is the master of disguise and gets grand joy from her control and manipulations of people and the power to alter situations to her demand.  It is truely sickening. 

I have more recently stopped all contact with her.  I hope I can do it this time forever.  The web is so difficult to escape.  It's like she has us (her kids) brainwashed from birth, yet once we all got into the real world we had a revelation of just how screwed up she is. 

It's funny.  I love my mother, but on what basis?  I honestly couldn't say.  I have no reason to.  It doesn't make any sense.

When I was young I was raped by a member of the church my family made us attend.  When it went public I was quickly neglected and my mother took the limelight quickly.  Soaking up all of the people doting on her and how aweful it was that this has happened to her family.  You know... My parents didn't ask me once if I was okay or seek me couselling.  My Dad just played right into the palm of her selfish tears that eeringly made me cringe from seeing some sort of satisfaction in her eyes from it.  The church and friends ran to her wailing performance.  It is one story like this after another.

She was so tempered too.  To be challenged or unpraised was forbidden.  I can't count the times I took a trip down the stair case due to her rage of defiance.  Or how many times she would test her power of guilt and demand.  Blah blah blah....

She is a master at being a conartist.  It disgusts me that I can't get her help and try to put this family back together.  You are so right..... about the whole denial thing.  She would take it as a challenge and reason to manipulate more to her favor.  She has no remorse or feeling- it's all performance.  Most people think that I am exagerating when I say that, but they just don't get it.  She really does feel nothing for others.

By the sounds of it, you really don't need me to tell you my stories since you talked in depth with your friend.  I have just NEVER met anyone who knew what the hell I'm talking about.  It felt like my soul came alive when I read your post.  I know, corny but so true!

wow *deep breath*
*sigh*  thank you.

I would love to have counselling.  In fact I wrote into Dr. Phil to bring my family on his show over 100 times.  Then the exec. prod. Laurie called me up a few months back and tried to get us on, but my mother refused to comply.  I honestly thought Dr. Phil could help us if I could just get us all to agree to go.  He would've seen right through her, I honest ly believe that.  Well, to be completely honest, I was a lil bit worried that she could even fool him.  She is good at who she has become. 

I can't afford counselling.  God I wish I could.  It's like we are kids brought into this world and kept in an abusive cube, then when released (more like escaping) into the world we realize we have zero tools to survive.  I don't mean how to physically live.  If anything we are tuff having survived my mother.  I just mean internally.  We have a terrible sef esteem, cover up our weeknesses by reaction, do the right things out of an engrained fear etc etc.  We don't have healthy life tools to deprogram and learn to deal with all that has been endured.

I would love to continue to talk to you about this.  Very much so!
 
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January 5, 2006, 9:04 pm PST

thanx

Quote From: josiemarie

I too suffered emotional abuse and physical abuse from my mom.  I made it my life's goal to learn how to help others get past  this and went to school to be a therapist.  One of the most powerful things one of my professors said to me is "You let your mom ruin the first 20 years of your life, are you going to let her ruin the next 20?"  I have studied many theories of personality and the combination of spirituality coupled with cognitive-behavioral techniques with a little bit of Rogerian unconditional positive regard has served me and my patients best.  For example, when you have an overly controlling mother you tend to become perfectionistic trying to win her love and approval as a child, thus you believe if you just did the right thing she would love you.  The problem with that is you become a people pleaser and you lose yourself in the process till the real you splinters off and you look in the mirror and you don't know who you are, what you like etc.  We say that your mom gave you the message of conditional love that if you do the right thing she will love you.  What you need to learn is that if conditional love got you there, it is unconditional love that heals you but you don't get it from other people.  If you try to get it from other people and they have a bad day you are at their mercy and not in control.  Yout get unconditonal love from yourself.  You learn how to pat yourself on the back when you do something good, not depend on others to notice or praise you.  Spirituality has this same concept called Agape love or the idea that I love you no matter what you do, I might not like what you do, but I will always love you.  Learning to be your own best friend and love yourself is not easy.  It takes a lot of unlearning.  That's where the cognitive approach works (or as Dr. Phil refers to it as negative self-talk.)  Anyhow that is a brief synopsis of how to heal.  Use everything and cover all your bases, medicine, exercise, surround yourself with positive people, therapy if needed, self-help books, and the icing on the cake is the spirituality put back in.  Good luck and God bless you.
Thank you for your response.  I appreciate your encouragement.  More than anything, I would love to know what you know about this disorder.  I saw in your profile that you are an RN and work amongst mental health patients.  I understand that I have a lot of internal rebuilding to do and it will probably be a life long challenge.  I keep pressing forward! :)  I am not the type of person to wollow though some times it is challenging.  I keep my head up most days and try to forget about where I have come from.  I can't always do that though.  Couselling is something I agree that would be heaven sent for me.  I am not yet in a position to finacially support theraputic help.  Sad to admit, but I have seen a pshyciatrist for over a decade.  Along with my father.  We both suffer from panic and anxiety attacks.  We both question if it is due to our enviroment, meaning my mother.  Since I have not spoken to my mother in months, I have managed to reduce my dose from 225mg to 75mg.  I have not suffered from one panic attack either.  There might be some truth to my mother's affect on us.  Everyday is a step closer to healing.  Though the memories are horrifying at times.  Again, thanks for replying.
 
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January 5, 2006, 9:53 pm PST

???

Quote From: bibleman1

Pray to Jesus and ask for understanding and wisdom and the truth Jesus Loves you
 I don't really know what to say to your post.  errr.... Thanks I guess.  Kinda of confused as to why you wrote what you did.  Ask Jesus for understanding and wisdom?  Have you ever bumped into Jezebel (a narcissist)  before?  Jesus's advice is probably to get the heck outta there and run fast the other way, lol!  That is probably the wisest thing to do.  As for understanding..... well, I am trying my best to comprehend this disease.  It is a hard one to wrap a brain around.  I'm sure your intentions were sensitive and sincere.  I am unfortunately guards up and quick (instinctively) to feel like words tossed up so vaguely are hollow.  Simply telling me to pray doesn't help much.  I actually felt like it was kind of belittling my circumstance.  Perhaps something is wrong with me to take your kind efforts that way.  I am not trying to banter with you AT ALL.  I am simply saying that I do not know how to appropriately and honestly reply to your post.  Perhaps you could just add me to your prayer list.  ;)
 
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January 5, 2006, 10:03 pm PST

too quick for me

Quote From: bibleman1

Jesus is all around you just waiting for you to ask him for his help if you get a chance go to www.demonbuster.com it has a ton of   prayers to choose from about different things move in Faith and your mountains will move cast fear doubt and disbelief from you and speak light into the darkness listen to the Word of God and trust God and Jesus and his Word
Sorry, like I said, I was sure your intentions were good.  Thank you for the site link.  That to me is more helpful than simply saying to pray.  Been praying all my life and well... I'm still praying.  Comes off as I may have little faith, but that isn't so.  I am just saying that God has not yet acted on my behalf yet.
 
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January 5, 2006, 10:27 pm PST

feel like a real arse

Quote From: bibleman1

Jesus is all around you just waiting for you to ask him for his help if you get a chance go to www.demonbuster.com it has a ton of   prayers to choose from about different things move in Faith and your mountains will move cast fear doubt and disbelief from you and speak light into the darkness listen to the Word of God and trust God and Jesus and his Word
 Once again, I can't tell you how much of a pin head I can be at times.  On the defense way too much.
I checked out the site you gave.  Went to the index and under #76 is a whole thing about Jezebel.  I can only assume that you are extremely aware of the power of her and her stronghold position she rules.  I wanted to share with you a link as well.  Let me know what you think.  It outlines in great detail the comparissons between a narcissist and the spirit of Jezebel.

http://sweety.com/Jezebel.pdf
 
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January 5, 2006, 10:48 pm PST

Hi Amy

Quote From: amyjayne26

Hello! 

I just wanted to let you know about something I saw first thing this morning on one of the morning shows.  Dr. Laura Schlessinger has a new book out called "Bad Childhood, Good Life."  It just came out and I thought of it when I read your messages.  I haven't been able to get a hold of this book yet, but I have read a few of her other books and she is usually right on when she talks.  At least I think so, she's definitely like Dr. Phil and will tell you what she is thinking and doesn't hold back.  Although *side note* on today's show I think he held back a lot more than I have seen before, about "spiritual" things.  I think I may post more about that later... 

But I just wanted to say that we all have bad childhoods in one sense.  Something happens that makes us who we are and it is up to us to decide what kind of future we will have.  I think that goes along with the topic discussed today.  It is up to us to decide what we will do with our lives, how we choose to look at the world, and how to spend our precious moments that we have left to live.  For me, all of those questions go hand in hand with my faith, as I am a Christian (I will never hide that), but what has helped me is to know that there is a lot more to life than myself.  I definitely found that out when I had my son, but sometimes I think we get into the mentality of thinking about ourselves all the time and thinking about what happened in the past and not letting go of our past hurts.  Myself when I was young, it was mostly attacks on myself and not from someone like your mother, but I can speak about forgiveness as I had to forgive myself.  Forgiving can do a lot for a person.  I think maybe you probably have a lot of soul searching to do before you can get to this point, but it helped me tremendously.  And forgiveness is not about just forgeting about it and starting new with a person as I have no belief that you should even be around your mother now.  It is a personal thing and not about what the other person can do or what you could do to make things right.   

Another part of that change in me is my acceptance of Christ into my life, I think it would be hard to tell you what helped me without saying that Him dying for my sins allowed me to see that I had to let go of my past and live in the present, since He has forgiven me.  Now I don't know what faith you are or anything about you, I am just letting you know what helped me.   And just so you know that I am appalled by how those church members shunded you like that.  I know from my past that not every church is the same, as I am now a different denomination from what I grew up in and a leader of my previous church betrayed my trust (although not in such a horrible way as you) but I would suggest trying to go back.  You may have to try a few different places until you feel comfortable.  But I believe a church home can offer a lot in the way of internal healing.  It is nice to be around people that love you and will be there when you need them.  Believe me it is possible.   

I don't know if Dr. Laura's book would help or not, but what's to lose.  You may have a lot to gain, you never know! :) 

Hope all goes well in your journey! 

Amy :) 

  

 I'm really surprised to all of the feed back I am receiving and so quickly.  This thread is so ambushed with so many people's thoughts and emotions, I never imagined my post would be noted and touch some people enough to reply.  Thank you.

I am a born again Christian.  I'm sure more than just yourself is wondering about that.  I have a very sincere relationship with the Lord and am not ashamed of it.  I do know how to pray and am extremely aware of spiritual warfare and the false seduction of it.

I grew up in an overly religious home that borderlined cultish activities.  The church that we were attending as a family when I was young and was raped, was a church that was full of manipulations of scripture and a church that had leaders who wanted to press on any accountability.  Very disturbing. 

I have been to many churches since, but never on a regular basis since.  Your senses on me were right about it being a challenge for me to be vulnerable to another body of christ.  I spend most of my faith by keeping it fairly personal.  My own studies, songs of praise and worship, and private prayer.  I have not forsaken my Father throughout my let downs.  I am fully aware that people come with flaws (sin) and in no way was it God's wish for any of those things to take place in his church.

Churches were hard to stick with my whole life.  My mother (errr.... mother spirit of Jezebel) has had her hand in every church and our family moved from one to the next.  My mom always got in cahoots with the pastor and his family, then the elders, then got herself onto the board or on some prestigeous level in her head, then she would tear them down from the inside.  The churches would suffer by what my mother would stir up and what curruption she would reveal to the congragation and move onto the next church.  Interesting way to find Jesus, but I did.  I just don't know how to trust other people in my beliefs.  I feel very secure when it is just God and I.

I will keep a heads up for Dr. Laura's book.  She's a funny cookie, I like!  Thank you for your input.

As for moving onward into the future, I think this is where some of the readers are misunderstanding out of normal ignorance.  Narcissim is very hard to escape.  Think of it like a person who is a conartist, lier, stalker that follows your life, will even bring in the court system to get what they want (like grandparent rights to my children), etc, etc.   It is an ongoing battle to move forward.  Forward usually means, just another day battling the influences of Jezebel.  It is way too hard to explain in a single post.

check out the sight I gave to bible guy.... forget his handle, lol.
Char
 
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January 5, 2006, 10:53 pm PST

:)

Quote From: liatsunami

If you would like to talk about this subject further feel free to email me at:

liatsunami@hotmail.com 

please put "narcissism" in the subject line.  I'll see if I can find some articles/web forums/support groups for you on this topic that might be helpful for you in dealing with this.

I am not a psychologist so I can't really give you professional grade advice, but I can try and share my experiences and knowledge, and try to help get you in touch with people that can help you.


 Thank you, I emailed!
 
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January 5, 2006, 11:00 pm PST

twist and shout

Quote From: amyjayne26

From the original message "and does anyone remember who visited Christ at Bethlehem?  My goodness, it was the THREE MAGI (in Greek the word "magi" means SORCERER) - These three Sorcerers (male witches) used astrology and dream interpretation to locate the Christ child.  So while the rest of the world just sat there, the Three PAGAN MAGI Sorcerers searched astrology for Christ, found him, and then worshiped him.  How is that for an accurate twist on the Biblical story? " 

  

Here is what I have to say about the Magi.  They worshipped the Christ child.  Doesn't that say anything????  It says a lot to me.  It tells me that the Lord can change anyone. :)  

 I like the twist on that one... :)
 

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