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Messages By: kimbrem

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July 25, 2005, 2:09 am CDT

Congratulations on starting this process

Hello all-

I am very excited to report that my husband and i have PCS'ed to Turkey and the cost of IVF here is amazingly cheap. He learned the procedure in the states and was the first doctor to have a successful IVF babie. It seem as though most of hispregnancies are twins....but i will take what i can get. We are awaiting my cycle so we can start our IVF cycle. I guess becausei am actuualy eager to see my period it wants to take its time. The cost of the IVF is 3,250 lira, which come out to be about 2,000 U.S dollars. You medication is an additional 1,500. Well guys thats all for now. Wish me luck....Hope to hear from someone soon...

Ryan

 I have to admit, I am somewhat envious. That sounds like it is so much cheaper there! We definitely would be in the process now if we had access to that kind of cost.  I have no idea what PCS'ed means, but I get the gist of what you're saying. I'm thrilled for you.  It's so hard to believe it's so cheaply priced there.

Kim
 
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July 27, 2005, 10:52 pm CDT

Difficulty balancing being authentic and correcting to social situations

 Please, whatever happens, when you read this, don't think me full of myself. I'm not. Although I do know the gift of my intelligence, I would sometimes love nothing better than to be an idiot.

I haven't read any of the books. Maybe someone could give me some good advice who has read them. I am an intelligent person. I have been labelled as "gifted" an "anomaly" "genius", etc. I have heard all my life how "lucky and different" I am. I am not sure of the idea of being different. I know that I am odd. I know that because I am mostly off the charts if I put any of me into it.

 I have a great difficulty in dealing with the social stigma associated with what I am. It isn't difficult when I am in social situations. It's not difficult not to respond when it's just a conversation. When I am in school and the purpose is learning and exploring knowledge, I stand out like a sore thumb. I am going back to school again. I love studying and learning. I love knowledge like it is water. I don't exactly fit into the classroom setting. I know I shouldn't care what others think, but I do. I am wounded when I hear groans after I announce a topic of study that may seem a bit over the heads of my fellow students. I am crushed to be the object of hostility from classmates who think I may have messed up their chance at getting an A off a curve, because I have one honestly. The honest joy that comes from learning is tempered by the fact that I don't seem to fit. I don't really wish to be a person who stands out, but melting in takes the joy out of study. I do feel that it inspires in some jealousy. I would rather be seen as a person on the same ground, just who is a little more inspired.  It is a little depressing to be outside the social circle. I have, in the past thrown my grade a bit. I never strive for a hundred percent. I really don't want a bad mark, but sometimes I just want to fit in more smoothly.

A couple of days ago, I ended up feeling very hurt and being more frank than I should have been. After one person said I was messing up the curve for the tenth time and asked the teacher how this was affecting their grades, I stood and said "Do you really think I am going to fall anywhere on your curve. My score will likely be discarded as an anomaly." Rather than making me fit in better, I am sure I just emphasized the differences between us and fostered more discord.

How can I honestly be what I am, and be part of what they are?

I'm a real person not a prodigy or savant or genius or whatever social label. I have a million hobbies. I love my dogs. I never remember where my keys are. I have to check the iron twice to make sure it's unplugged. If I lose my glasses, it's slapstick comedy (Think crawling around the house two inches from everything). I think sometimes people only see certain parts and forget I'm just like they are.
 
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July 28, 2005, 8:25 pm CDT

thanks

Quote From: marcia52

1st - are you going after a degree or are you just taking classes to learn?

 

If you are not, than may I suggest that you audit the classes so that you aren't interfering with others.  I too love to learn and getting my associate degree was so hard because I kept changing my major until 1 day, I finally said I can't go on like this anymore. Sat down with the degree list and figured out what degree I could obtained the quickest.  I was able to obtain my associate degree in 1 quarter and that was years ago.

 

I thought about getting a 4 year degree but again, doing what!?  I have way too many interests.

 

So - now that I'm out of work and looking for a new career - I finally discovered an AHA moment when the local university continuing education center offered a Technical Writer Certificate if I take 5 classes.  They also have other certificates I could go after too.

 

There's no testing, no curves -- just me and a whole different way of learning.

 

I had to teach myself to be organize -- if I don't put my glasses in 1 particular spot at night, I lose them.  Lord help me if I take a nap and I don't put them on the end table - cause it's embarrassing when you think you have to call someone to your house to find them.  I have 3 dogs, 4 cats & a kitten (she found me!) and they are my family. 

 

I stopped worrying about what people thought of me when I did Self Matters -- because I worried about what they thought and felt, I allowed myself to be victimized.  I have spent over 30 years adjusting to being different.

 

My friends say I have a good heart and they have never left me -- I have people who still are in contact with me from Junior High School -- I know that my differences drive people crazy and that my energy drains many of them.  But they are still in my life.

 

I suggest you pick up SELF MATTERS and find out why you feel the need to be a PART  OF WHAT THEY ARE. 

I am working towards a degree. The classes are biology and chemistry and then radiology classes and cannot be taken independently (which I would, if I could).  I absolutely know why I want to be accepted. I normally don't worry about other's opinions. I am different. I know I am different and am ok with that. It is not gratifying to be "intelligent". There isn't a sense of self-accomplishment. It's just all chalked up to "being smart".  I like people. I am not unpopular. I do have a wonderful assortment of peers that I am happy to be around. There are always other people who are "different" and they are usually very acceptant of others of the same or different kinds of differences.

I like all people, well, mostly. I don't form negative opinions based on differences in intelligence, talent, religion, etc. It just seems so extremely difficult to be around people who have belief systems which make it ok to be hostile to others who are different from them. To me it is not acceptable to mock or degrade another persons beliefs. It's great to disagree and discuss/ debate issues. I so would like for it to be a part of my "educational experience" to foster that kind of discussion and debate. I would so want to face an open-minded set of peers. To me, it heightens my enjoyment and learning. My "differences" seem to inhibit that part of the experience. I am coming to realize that maybe if my "differences" are stunting those, it's not really my differences, but maybe that kind of open academic environment just isn't there.
 
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July 28, 2005, 8:30 pm CDT

Thanks

Quote From: ritehere

I feel your pain. Why is it that we revere some people with talent (athletes, actors, singers) and don't expect them to have a thought in their heads otherwise, and even excuse their bad behavior, but ostracise the more intelligent of us? I'm nowhere near the higher intelligence levels, but I have siblings who are. I once had the experience of moving from a progressive school system to a rather poorly funded (shall we say) rural one. I was 1 to 2 grades ahead of the class, because this school was not at the same level as the last, and heard alot of the groans you spoke of, so I can relate. The good thing was, the old school system taught us in a way that nobody was aware that some were ahead of others, and nobody felt dumb. It made for an atmosphere where learning was fun, that has stuck with me for life.
In answer to your question, yes you can be what you are, and be part of what they are. Try doing something that you have absolutely no talent for, and ask for help from one of the people who see you as a "brain." If you fall on your face, laugh at yourself. Others will see you in a different way. See, some of them fall on their faces everday in class, or that's what it feels like to them. Never compromise on tests though, throwing them is phony. Football players don't compromise their talents to make the rest of the team look better, why should you?
 I am at least feeling alot better today. I guess stress always impacts the way you view things and the way you react to them. I am usually better at self-deprecation in a humorous way which has a way of easing the differences with my peer-set. I have just realized lately that I have been under more stress than usual and have not been able to respond with the humor that usually makes other people feel better, and therefore myself. Instead, I have been internalizing my peers reactions to me, and that's never good. Leaves me feeling bad, and them feeling worse.

I just really need to practice that whole meditation and destress thing, i think.

Kim
 
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July 28, 2005, 10:36 pm CDT

Also....

Quote From: kimbrem

 I am at least feeling alot better today. I guess stress always impacts the way you view things and the way you react to them. I am usually better at self-deprecation in a humorous way which has a way of easing the differences with my peer-set. I have just realized lately that I have been under more stress than usual and have not been able to respond with the humor that usually makes other people feel better, and therefore myself. Instead, I have been internalizing my peers reactions to me, and that's never good. Leaves me feeling bad, and them feeling worse.

I just really need to practice that whole meditation and destress thing, i think.

Kim
 I have to admit .... having positive conversations with peers and people like you has helped turn my own mood around. I guess because of the vicious circle of stress and it's affect on my own self-esteem coupled with a difficult social situation, which I didn't handle as well because of an already stressed mood just acted as as reinforcement to the first negative and created a terrible circle until I could remove myself and get in a frame of mind to examine it and respond with a better response.



Some people will never like me, they have their own dialogue and events which influence their responses towards me. See.... I really am just like everyone else. I have to accept my own role in the cycle and make it as good as I can. That's my own issue. I would love to be able to just make everyone, including myself realize that just because we are different in some ways, lots of ways, lots of differences..... that we are all so very much human. There are no bionic people. Those differences are wonderful, beautiful things for the most part and I wouldn't do without them. I need to remember to do my own part in making it clear how I feel about the differences among us. Maybe the rest of the world will follow suit? I hope so. I wouldn't want everyone to be like me. I'm kinda boring.

Thanks so much to you and everyone for helping me to reach a better state of mind and be better prepared to cope with these things.

Kim
 
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July 29, 2005, 12:33 am CDT

BTW

Quote From: marcia52

1st - are you going after a degree or are you just taking classes to learn?

 

If you are not, than may I suggest that you audit the classes so that you aren't interfering with others.  I too love to learn and getting my associate degree was so hard because I kept changing my major until 1 day, I finally said I can't go on like this anymore. Sat down with the degree list and figured out what degree I could obtained the quickest.  I was able to obtain my associate degree in 1 quarter and that was years ago.

 

I thought about getting a 4 year degree but again, doing what!?  I have way too many interests.

 

So - now that I'm out of work and looking for a new career - I finally discovered an AHA moment when the local university continuing education center offered a Technical Writer Certificate if I take 5 classes.  They also have other certificates I could go after too.

 

There's no testing, no curves -- just me and a whole different way of learning.

 

I had to teach myself to be organize -- if I don't put my glasses in 1 particular spot at night, I lose them.  Lord help me if I take a nap and I don't put them on the end table - cause it's embarrassing when you think you have to call someone to your house to find them.  I have 3 dogs, 4 cats & a kitten (she found me!) and they are my family. 

 

I stopped worrying about what people thought of me when I did Self Matters -- because I worried about what they thought and felt, I allowed myself to be victimized.  I have spent over 30 years adjusting to being different.

 

My friends say I have a good heart and they have never left me -- I have people who still are in contact with me from Junior High School -- I know that my differences drive people crazy and that my energy drains many of them.  But they are still in my life.

 

I suggest you pick up SELF MATTERS and find out why you feel the need to be a PART  OF WHAT THEY ARE. 

 I am also at a sort of life change in education as you are. I'm trying for the radiology program locally. I'm having a difficult time deciding where I want my career there to go. I have fertility issues and since we have had such a time getting through it, I would love to be a part of the community that helps other women to get help with that. However, since it is such a difficult, sensitive and emotionally draining aspect in my life, I am a little afraid it may be too difficult for me emotionally to be a part of that on a daily basis. I am having such a difficult time coming to terms with it.  I am not sure if it would be better to separate my career from trying to in some way impact other people's struggle with infertility or if it would be less rewarding.

I really want to be part of what makes a difference. Since this is something that has personally impacted me, my marriage and my husband so strongly, I feel this is where I want to make the difference. It was actually a big part of why I chose the radiology program. The field, tempered, of course, with financial and time-constraint issues.

Maybe someone has some advice and some good 20/20 vision on this issue. If so, I certainly welcome it.

Kim
 
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July 29, 2005, 1:04 am CDT

Oh, I feel for you and him

Quote From: teri_id

You know, Life continues to be a learning experience.  My boyfriend and I have pack goats.  We take them into the mountains, and they faithfully carry anything we ask.  Our oldest goat, Mackay, was with us the last time we went in the middle of June.  While we were hiking, there was a rather large log we all had to cross.  Everyone made it across, yet afterwards, Mackay stumbled a bit.  He didn't complain or give us any indication that he was in pain, so we continued. 

 

 There have been may times since we came home from that trip that Mackay came and rubbed us with his head with tears in his eyes.  I even remarked that I did not know goats could cry, but seeing this had a deep effect on me.  Appearantly not deep enough.

 

Last Sunday we were in the barnyard giving the baby goats their last bottle and found Mackay laying down.  At first we thought he was dead.  He did pick up his head when I walked to him, and when I touched him, he was incredibly hot.  We immediately gave him water to drink, which he drank half a bucket in just a few seconds.  We got him to stand up and he stumbled on his front leg.  I felt over his legs, seeing if there was any heat or anything and when feeling under his chest I found a very old wound, infected and gangrenous. 


Turns out, when we crossed that log, my boyfriend remembered a stick poking up, and when Mackay crossed, he must have punctured his chest with that stick.  He had been suffering from this the whole time.

 

We started right away, doing all of the right things, trying to save our sweet goat.  He is doing better, but only time will tell. 

 

I have not slept well the last few nights because of the guilt I feel for not heeding those tears I saw.  I felt it in my gut that something was wrong, and I ignored it.  I have learned a huge lesson at an innocent friend's expense.  Thus, I am carrying guilt. 

 

I am not sharing this story for anyone to tell me not feel bad, how could I have known, etc.  I am sharing this because I am trying to own my part, which was not listening.  Anyone have any solid advice on how to help the guilt?  It is not really helping anything, yet it has even effected my appetite.  This sort of thing cannot be good, and in the past my M.O. has been to ignore it, pretend I didn't feel anything.  Well, being authentic means being real, and my real right now is I feel guilty and I am not sure what to with it.  Any input would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks for "listening" to me.

Teri

 I have issues with guilt as well. I share a similar type of event with you.

 A little over six years ago, I left my pekingese with my father so that I could go meet my now husband. I was going through a rough time in life and, after talking with my husband for some time about computer things and each other, I felt like it was time to meet and find out if he was too good to be true. I planned on either returning or returning to get my darling pekingese to take with me as soon as possible. I spoke with my father and he said he would take good care of him. My father is a man disposed to violence after drinking, and had not too long before left a sizeable( 12" or so) cut in my arm, not to mention choking and ultimately ended up at the other end of a 9mm I had bought (which I sold shortly thereafter, because I didn't want to end up pulling the trigger). He is not a nice man when he drinks, which is often. This I knew, but failed to adequately consider when I left that sweet, defenseless puppy there.

Needless to say, I went back a few weeks later, having realized my mistake in leaving him and being filled with terror at finding him poorly disposed, I went back to get my darling. I found him with a ulcer in one eye that had eaten to the retina. We took him for treatment, but he was permanently blinded in that eye and forever left disabled and not whole.

 The worst part, I have no idea what he endured while there. I can only imagine, and it makes me so full of sadness for his suffering because of my very poor judgement. I can never forgive my father for his injuries. He was defenseless. I am still riddled with guilt for my own part in his suffering.

The best part... my little darling, my husband and I are a very happy family. My husband helps me spoil him by giving him more attention than I possibly could have alone. The spoiled character gets the best of healthcare, the best of food, massages at least every other day, tummy rubs several times a day, playing always and laps snuggles whenever we sit. We carry him outside, down the stairs four to six times a day to potty, since he can't on his own. He has a full life and the vet is amazed at his health. He is still as healthy and happy as a puppy. I am forced to admit my husbands insight is correct. It happened, it's terrible it ever did. My little darling is still the happiest, spoiled, healthy and sweet doggy to ever walk the face of the earth. He's alright, so should I be.

He is now thirteen years old, and has recently lost the sight in his other eye. I assuage my own guilt by making sure that he is well taken care of. He is spoiled and I am happy that way. He has forgiven me, he never held it against me. Animals are great that way. He has never associated me with that pain. He associates me with salvation from it. We should take our cues from them. You didn't hurt him, the stick did. We do the best we can. They love us for it. Just treat him with the best you can and make him happy.


 
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July 29, 2005, 1:21 am CDT

I know the feeling of trying to find yourself

Quote From: kaatje

Hello all,

 

I'm new here and for a while now I have been trying to find myself. In this quest I recently found out that everything I thought was my past, all seems a lie. My mother has lied to us about many, important things, and we believed it all to be true, until a week ago.....

Now my question, when everything you believed turns out te be false, the mother who you have always trusted, you can not trust anymore and your whole youth, has been taken from you, where do you start then to find yourself ?

I feel like my whole bases has been taken from me and I don't know where to start anymore. But, I must say, a lot of things fall in their place now, as painfull it may be. I feel like I have to start all over again and that's very difficult for me ...

 

Í'm sorry if my English isn't very well, but it's not the language I speak every day.

 

I wish you all all the luck in finding yourself and I hope this list can put me in the right direction to find my true self.

 

Thank you

 

 If you have a family that is destructive or toxic, it just seems the normal way to be, not right, but normal. There is usually a feeling and even strong belief that this is not right. This is not the way things should be. In childhood, we are often helpless, in spite of all we do to change it. Our lack of insight, experience, and inability to fend for ourselves makes it almost impossible to change what shouldn't be into what should.

When we make a break from the influences of those toxic relationships, it leaves us scared, uncertain, emotionally torn and left to figure out who we really are without them. There are so many aspects to discovery and self-fulfillment. I am on the same road. I am so lucky not to have ended up as a percentage point on someone's chart. I thank the gifts my parent's unwittingly gave me for that. I love my parents. I don't love who they are, but I am now relieved of any clouds that were previously in my eyes about who they are.

Don't worry about what you are feeling. It's natural. There are stages to dealing with these things. Just try to move ahead through them without letting yourself get stuck in one that's toxic to you.

Good Luck,

Kim
 
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July 29, 2005, 2:15 am CDT

Me

 I'm sorry if I came in unintroduced. I'll correct that now.

My name is Kim. I've been in the process of changing my life for six years. One step at a time. I have difficulty dealing with stress. I know it stems from my background. I am happily married and have a wonderful life now. My husband is THE Most Beautiful Man on the face of the planet! Finding someone like him who shared my very soul was one of my earlier steps in healing me.

 I have an alcoholic, abusive father who has a heart of gold when sober, a somewhat "eccentric" mother who is too self-absorbed to care about anyone but herself, a brother who deals drugs and sponges and uses and steals from anyone who is foolish enough to care, and one brother who has a severe psychosis that I personally comitted after waking to the end of a rifle and a conversation that indicated he thought I was part of a government conspiracy to harm him "the son of god". My parents encouraged us to hold each other down or help kick or hit each other. I can say thank god, I was never sick enough to participate on the giving end.

I faced too many crisis in my past with stressful situations. Other than the obvious ones of being in a toxic family where abuse was a "way of controlling us" because "we were out of control", I have been held up at gun-point, beaten until my ribs were shattered by a stepfather and left with a head trauma from three of my peers who didn't like me. I spent 18 months in juvenile detention after running away (the worst part was not being able to pick a flower or sit beside the lake). I really wanted to be peaceful. I spent about 8 years anoerexic off and on. My way of dealing with it in childhood was to curl up in a ball until it was over. I finally got angry several years ago. I got tired, then I got angry and then I started to change.

I jump at loud noises and startle easily. I hate confrontation.

I was "taught" to be a victim. I was taught that fighting back and leaving issues led to more pain. I have unlearned that, but now have great difficulty dealing with stress and conflict. I would rather just get away from it. I know that I seek love and approval because of my need for it in the past. I am getting over that.  I am lucky. My husband is someone I can share my feelings with. He is someone who respects how things scare me and how life affects me differently.

I love animals, I am moved to tears by the sight of new leaves and blossoms on flowers. I am inspired by art and love to dance to the beat of a drum. I find myself dropping off bags from Wendy's to those people holding signs at the highways. I hug strangers who cry and end up crying with them, for them. I can imagine the worst. I do sympathize with those who face hardship. I am somewhat hardened to people who abuse substances because of my firsthand knowledge of how it can hurt others. I don't drink because I'm afraid of "being like him". I have a somewhat diluted sense of humor. I am intelligent, but know it doesn't pave any ways. I don't dress up or wear make-up. I have prematurely gray hair. I've read Chaucer in the oldest language. I  value books. I love people, but I'm somewhat scared of them. I have difficulty trusting police because of my personal experiences with them. I only learned to speak the word sex out loud after I met my husband. I am 34, but my spirit feels one hundred. My husband says I am sappy, because I cry at the movies. The sight of a newborn makes me cry. The sight of a mother holding one tenderly makes me smile. The idea of talking about my background fills me with dread that people will see me as a person in that light. I am scared of being judged and saddened by the thought that I will be thought of in light of those things.

Now, I am attending school and trying to find my place in the world. I don't know how I can change things. We are infertile. I know some people would call this a blessing. I'm just not one of them. I know I can change how I deal with things and have made alot of strides in six years. I am slowly being deprogrammed in my responses and welcome any help in getting there.

Kim
 
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July 29, 2005, 8:14 am CDT

I am a little along in my studies

Quote From: marcia52

Kim, it sounds like you are in a lot of pain except where the radiology falls into play. 

 

I know that the administrative career I chose was helpful in dealing with my emotions and victimize issues because I could earn a paycheck while I healed. 

 

Have you thought about going to a counselor that is trained in Cognitive Therapy to help you work thru your issues to help you to decide?

 

If you haven't been going to school for long then I suggest you focus on your core classes:  ENGLISH, MATH, SCIENCE, etc.  That would enable you to work thru your issues a little and then you could decide if you want to still do radiology or another health science career.

 

Check out the college HEALTH degree circumlium and see what is common for all.  English 101 is English 101 for nearly all of them.  The maths are different if you plan on going for a computer degree or science degree or health degree -- but there is a common thread.

 I have taken all maths, literature, speech, chemistry, history, logic, psychology, microbiology, government. At this point all that is left are major courses. I have been out of school for awhile, but it's great to finally finish this. I have considered going to a counselor for help in deciding, but really haven't had a clue what kind of professional would be able to help me make that kind of decision. It's awhile before I will graduate, so I will definitely seek out a Cognitive therapist. I wish I even knew they existed before now.

Thanks,
Kim
 

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