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Messages By: ulrika

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September 19, 2005, 7:44 pm PDT

Why spank

Ok, now it is my turn to talk. 

I am very much opposed to spanking, I believe it only teaches children to use violence, and if their friends for example don't do what they tell them to do it is ok to hit. I have a hard time believing that a child can differenciate between discipline and being hit. To them I believe it is the same thing.  

Why in the world can't our children have the same rights as us adults??   Why can't we protect our children for physical harm when we are protected by law???  Why is it ok to degrade children and then call it discipline?? Why can't the US take after Sweden to illegalise spanking??   

  

Me and my husband don't spank our 2 year old, we will never do it but we have a friend that is doing that to his child, and the fear that child has in his eyes if he thinks that he is gonna be spanked is heartbreaking to see.  Does anyone by chance have any suggestions on what to do with that situation??  I don't want my son to see that his friend is being spanked/hit.  I am trying to teach my son that it is never ok to hit other people but this situation showes him that appearently it is ok to hit.   Am I the only one in this situation??   I do need some advice.  When we had them over for dinner one night and I believe they stayed for maybe about 3-4 hours, this poor child got spanked probably half a dozen times.  Every time I wanted to yell out and protect that child.  

  

  

  

 
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September 19, 2005, 8:46 pm PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: blewbyu41

my suggestion is...find friends with your beliefs if you feel that strongly about it!!! 

Just what we need ...another law from the government telling how to raise our children....the  

more law you put in it ...seems like the worse this world gets.  ...look backwards to the days of Leave it to Beaver....no gov't. laws about spanking your child.  JMO 

Like I said, it is one friend but it is my husbands best friend.  And why not have that as a law to protect our children??  We have laws to protect us adults why not children??  I think child abuse would decrease dramatically if it was a law. Where is the line  between spanking and abuse then??  There is other ways to discipline your child then spanking.
 
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September 20, 2005, 8:17 am PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: tselb2

Your home is your home.  If you don't agree with spanking, ask them in an adult conversation to please refrain from spanking their child in your home.  You can let them know you believe it is a bad influence on your child (in your opinion) so please choose other forms of discipline.  I do not allow anyone to curse, smoke, or speak meanly in our home b/c it is a bad influence on our children.  If people don't like it, they don't have to come over.  Quite simple to me. 

  

Quite frankly, if they are there only 3-4 hours and the child has been "spanked" THAT many times, they are not spanking.  I'm not sure why the child has to be disciplined that many times if the form of discipline is effective.  They CLEARLY need another form of teaching if this is the case.  ALL forms of discipline should have positive, definite, lasting results.  If they are spanking THAT many times, the child is not getting it.  Now, if he has special needs, they need to guide him/her more instead of spanking.  Spanking should be a consequence that is CLEARLY understood, carried out, and then resume with normal activity as with any consequence.  It sounds to me that the child is just being smacked for whatever and no lesson is learned.   Spanking, IMO, will not be against the law b/c it has been effective for too long when used properly.  There are no laws protecting us from consequences of wrong choices (i.e. speeding ticket when speeding).  Child abuse IS against the law in the US.  It is a hard crime to convict on b/c it is sometimes difficult to see all the damage being done when you are not around.  And yes, there other ways to discipline, but not always as effective in that time frame.  If you don't know the line between spanking and abuse, I would strongly suggest you not spank as well.  For us, it is VERY clear where the line is and even my children could share that with you. 

  

Take care, 

Tselb2 

I didnt implie that I don't know the line between spanking and abuse. I don't spank at all because I think it causes more damage then good.   

They spank this little boy in my opinion for no reason at all, he pushed my son a little, my son did not fall did not get hurt and this boy got a smack for it, in my opinion it is to much. He closed the door pretty hard, he is 3 years old he doesnt know how hard he is closing the door, it scared my son a little bit and he got smacked for that. They dont give him any warnings or even talk to him about what he is doing, they just smack him.  

  

I know child abuse is against the law but in my and a lot of other peoples opinion it is child abuse. I think every child should have the right to grow up in an environment that is safe from smacks, spankings, abuse and violent. We adults have that right, why not our children?? 

  

  

  

  

 
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September 20, 2005, 1:44 pm PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: jettav

Exactly, it is an opinion. to spank or not to spank is up to the parent to decide and no government has the right to come into any ones home and tell them how to discipline a child. yes, my children have been spanked, it is a rare thing around here but I will not hesitate if need to and my children are not abused, physically or mentally. They are very well adjusted kids. You, in my opinion are describing an abused child because he is just getting slapped around for whatever reason and isn't even being told what he is doing wrong. Communication I believe is an imporant key to discipline/ raising a child to become great adults. just because you and a lot of other people think spanking is abuse doesn't make it so, there are many people as well who do not believe it is abuse so you do not have a good arguement there. So, what do you think should happen? Every one who gives their child a swat on the bottom should have child protective services called on them? I know a family who was accused of abusing their child and their kids taken away when in reality they were innocent and a family torn apart all becasue of one persons agenda and opinion, it just doesn't work, there are many children abused and who falls through the cracks of the system and you want to accuse innocent parents of abuse because they spank. I think if you want to go after abusers, you need to go after the REAL abusers, the children who are harmed, your opinion is just that, so I would advise yuo not to spank, stick up for the abused but don't accuse, accusing can ruin good and happy families. And by the way, my children are living in a happy, fun environment and safe as well. I treat my kids the same way in public as I do at home, You would be surprised how well behaved and happy a spanked child can be, as I said, it is a rare thing but I won't hesitate, the key to good discipline is to be consistent and teach the child and if they continue to repeat the actions over and over then something is wrong and a new method needs to take place, My oldest is in preschool and she has gotten many compliments on her behavior as well as skills, she is a loving and friendly little girl, she is smart and very socially and physically active. She loves school and at the same time excited when I pick her up, that does not sound like an abused child to me, believe me, I know what abuse is for I lived through it and I would never abuse my children and yes I have spanked.

oohhh this is a sticky subject. 

This is what I am talking about, one family say it is discipline, the other one says it is abuse. The line is different from person to person.   

I think too that communication is the key when it comes to discipline, and I dont what the government to tell me how to raise my children but I do want the government to protect our children. That is two different things. My question was that still no one have answered is why doesn't our children have the same right as we adults do??   Why do we have the right not be spanked/hit in our home, work environment but our children does not have that right??  It seems to me that we are treating people very differently when it comes to a simple human right issue because that is what it is to me. If your husband/boyfriend/manager would spank you in a disciplinary way of course you would robably sue or leave beacuase he is being abusive, why doesnt that apply to our children as well?? 

  

 
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September 20, 2005, 9:31 pm PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: jettav

Why do we as the parent have the right to take priveleges away from our children, why do we have the right to sit them in time out? Why do we have the right to discipline them at all? Do we take priveleges away from our spouse when they misbehave? Do we sit them in time out when they make wrong choices? Maybe we should just sit around and wait for the child to make the right choice. Then what? They end up like the little kids on todays Dr. Phil show and the sad thing is, they were all under 10 years of age. We discipline to teach and to guide and spouses/partners who hit does it out of anger and for control. They do not want to take the time to discuss the issue at hand, they abuse. I think as you said, it is a sticky subject therefore all of us as parents need to be careful not to judge others just becasue we don't agree on discipline techniques. believe me, there are many forms of discipline and I believe all forms of discipline can get out of hand and become abuse. I for one, respect my children and they are learning that as they grow. They are learning right from wrong and they know where they can go when they are hurting or need a hug, whatever. parents who spank can be loving and excellent parents as I know many as well as parents who don't. it is about love, respect and communication and a child senses all that. And when it comes to the government, I think our system sucks when it comes to protecting children of abuse and until they get their act together there, they have absolutely no right to tell me as a parent that I am abusing my children just because it is based on opinions. There are children being beat and starved, even death because others didn't want to get involved or the abuser gets off scott free or with little punishment. Again, this is a sticky subject but before one starts accusing, they better have proof before they go into some ones home and ruins a good stable home. I am sure I probably didn't answer your question but in all reality, there is a big difference in an adult hitting another adult for in all honesty, I have never known an adult to hit another with out it being in anger, revenge or to be in control and that is not discipline, that is nothing but disrespect and uncaring. Speaking for my self, I would welcome any one in my home and I would guarentee that they would find that my children are well off in my home, absolutely no signs of abuse, so I and their daddy must be doing something right. I have nothing to hide when it comes to my children and I have never been ashamed of my children's behavior, why should I be, they are well disciplined kids and they follow the rules and know how to act at home as well as in public. It is definetly a sticky subject and that is why judging and pointing fingers is wrong. but I will say there are parents that I would like to shake a little bit as their children are out of control and they come from both sides of the issue, some are spanked and others are not. Every one certainly has the right to their opinions but it doesn't prove anything. I think we all need to search and follow our own hearts and have the best interest of our children in mind and it doesn't hurt to evaluate ourselves as well as our situations as well, I personally have changed parenting techniques with my children, we live and learn, none of us are perfect but if we can look at our selves honestly and have an open mind then and be willing to change what we need to, then we will raise our kids into becoming great and productive adults. Any way, I am off this thing for a while, been on too much but I will be back.

Even though you and me think very opposite in this issue I find it very interesting to discuss the issue with you.    

It is a very sticky issue and I feel very passionate about this.  I am not used to see parents spank/hit their children and then call it discipline. But I am also not from this country and where I am from it is illegal. This is the hardest thing to get used to I must say.    You and me can not agree on this issue so lets agree to disagree.  I have enjoyed talking to you about it though. 

  

Take care 

  

  

 
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September 21, 2005, 11:32 am PDT

General Advice

Quote From: sedmaiden

I have a 3 1/2 yr old son and I am fighting to get him to toilet train! He knows what to do, how to do it, but refuses. I have called the doctors office and they told me don't push him, and sent me some copied pages from a book on toilet training. I am at my wits end with this. I have tried the reward system, along with trying to punish by taking away what he likes. That hasn't worked. I tried to explain to him that he would be able to go to school and play with other kids his age, I even took him to the preschool and he saw where the children play. He sort of has the idea that he wants to go to school, but it quickly leaves his mind. I am really trying, but I feel like pulling my hair out!! I have heard horror stories of how people have tied their children to the potty chair, I was petrified to say the least and the woman suggested I do it to my son. I told her I would rather wait and continue cleaning his behind, then to traumatize my son! I am very frightened by the crazy responses that I have heard from people about this! Is there someone who would have a piece of advice that may help out. I really don't know what else to do, besides wait until he decides to do it on his own!

Hello, 

  

My advice would be not to push him to go to the potty. This is where he have the power. Maybe he is not ready yet completely. Let him wear underwear and not trainingpants, he needs to feel when he is wet. 

  

Good Luck 

  

  

 
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September 30, 2005, 1:23 pm PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: joeys1986

Spanking children is TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE. It only teaches the child(ren) that violence is the right way to get what one wants. Violence is NEVER JUSTIFIED. Spanking should be illegal everywhere. I call spanking (and any form of corporal punishment, for that matter) a punishment that fits no crime. What I mean is that there is not a bad thing on God's great earth; in fact, not a bad thing in the entire universe that a child can do to deserve a spanking or other form of corporal punishment. Other forms of corporal punishment I have read and heard about include beating, scalding in hot bath water, and locking a child in his/her room. I heard about an example of the second form listed above. A few years ago, a couple of parents got the bright idea (and I mean that ironically) of scalding their then-3-year-old son in hot bath water after he defecated in his pants. It is just horrible how parents punish their children. Corporal punishment is NEVER JUSTIFIED. Parents need to find other (non-violent) ways to punish their children, like the stuff Dr. Phil suggests on this website.

I agree with you. Spanking is never justified, I do hope it will be illegal in this country. But it seems to me that people here are more concerned about the parental right to spank then to protect our children from harm. There is other ways to discipline the children. 7 other countries in the world are doing just fine without the spankings. 

  

 
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October 7, 2005, 10:31 pm PDT

The Show

I  have to say what I think about this.  

What is the big deal about breastfeeding in public???  If you are hungry you are going to eat, if the baby is hungry, the baby is going to eat. I don/t see how breastfeeding can be offensive to anyone 

  

Condoms in school, I am all for it. But you have to have education about sex as well. I think that is a great way to get teen pregnancies under control for example. I read somewhere that US have the highest amount of teen pregnancies and Holland have the lowest. Holland do have good sex education in school, I don't know if the hand out condoms though but my shool did when I was in high school. It worked wonders. 

  

Someone else disciplining your child. It all depends on the situation. If I am on a plany with my 2 year old and he is kicking on the seat in front of him and I have told him a gazillion times to stop. I wouldnt mind having the person he is kicking telling my child to stop.  

  

These are my thoughts on it. 

  

   

 
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October 8, 2005, 7:46 pm PDT

Tired of non understanding men

I am so tired of non understanding husbands, my own included. He is a wonderful man but he do not get how much work it is for a SAHM. I am basically on call 12-13 hours a day. 7 days a week 365 days a year. If god forbid I am sick I have to get over it and still do everything that has to be done. Taking care of our child, cleaning the house, make sure the laundry is done. It is a ongoing job and you never get done. My husbands favorite line  to me when I tell him  that it is too much sometimes is "Ohh just sit down and relax for a while" All you SAHM knows how impossible that is with a 2 year old running all over the place.  I have tried to tell him what it's like but he don't have a clue.   The thing that pissing me off is that he does not see what needs to be done.  Sometimes I feel like a maid instead of a wife. If I am doing everything alone now why not be alone. this is just frustrating to me that I have to nag him to do things. 

  

Arggggggggghhhh 

 
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October 8, 2005, 7:51 pm PDT

10/10 Wifestyles

Quote From: blupoet

  

Bill, Bill, Bill. It would appear that you, not the women that have responded to this topic, are the one with the issues.  These women were merely stating their values, their beliefs on what makes their husbands and in turn, themselves happy.  

  

You assume that all they do is sit on their butt, watching television or surfing the Internet all day, is that the example that you had in your household? Or are you an insecure man who feels the need to assert his supposed superiority on the woman that he married? I believe that it is the latter. 

  

Very few women, or men for that matter, today stand by the ways of gender roles.  Men and women are equals in most households. We share child rearing and we share the work load.  You need to come off the mindset that a woman's place is at home, barefoot and pregnant, happily awaiting her husband with a fresh tin of muffins. 

Very few women, or men for that matter, today stand by the ways of gender roles.  Men and women are equals in most households. We share child rearing and we share the work load.  You need to come off the mindset that a woman's place is at home, barefoot and pregnant, happily awaiting her husband with a fresh tin of muffins.  

  

  

I don't think we are as equal as we think we are. As long as woman are making abour 70 cent to a dollar compare to men we are not going to be equal. As long as the sociaty basically forces woman to stay at home (me included) because child care is so expensive we can not be equals. When men can and will take out paternity leave and stay at home so they know what it is all about we can get closer to being equal.  The majority of households in the US the woman are doing the housework chores.  As long as we are doing that we will not be equal.  When I was working I still did the majoriy of the household chores. As long as moms (me included) raises our sons that they don't have to learn any household chores we will not be equal. I think my generation is changing a lot of this old gender roles ( I am 32)  but we have a long long way to go.   

  

  

 

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