Dr. Phil.com - Messageboards

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

May 9, 2006, 5:29 pm PDT

I'm not sure what to think about this.

To me the mother seems like she would have been happy with the prospect of her ex-husband allowing her visitation with her daughters before they were removed from the country. She doesn't seem to have nessecarily wanted to have custody of them. So I'm not sure why he took them in the FIRST PLACE. I'm a bit confused.

I understand the girls want to please both parents. They don't want either parent to be unhappy or disappointed with them. It's up to a therapist to decide whether the girls have been "brainwashed" or have simply made a lifestyle choice and are REALLY content with that.

The daughter with glasses seems to focus more on the cultural reasons why she does not wish to live a "normal life" while the other girl seems to be stating religious reasons. Which I found interesting. That's all well and good either way, but their mother still has a right to have access to them. I just hope she reacts to them in a way that allows them to grow and change, I hope the father sees how important that is too. That the girls feel supported and loved no matter what way they shoose to live. They seem like such sweet and good girls.

Read Replies to this Message

liatsunami

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

May 10, 2006, 9:34 am PDT

05/09 Finding Allene and Mollie

Quote From: sweetcarry

possibly in danger of isolation....unless of course these kids expect to live this lifestyle forever...let me ask you....are mennonites/amish the majority or the minority in society...if they are the minority..then I rest my case about isolation and the potential of not being able to be socialized or assimilate into the majority

I honestly see that there is potential for these girls to be set apart because of their lifestyle. What does that say about our society? If these girls are nice, repectful, and obey the law than society has no right to oppose their manner of dress or their religious convictions. The reality is there will always be people who respect their decisions and people who won't. It's just a matter of giving them the confidance to be who they are, whether that means they live the PLAIN lifestyle or not.

Read Replies to this Message

liatsunami

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

May 10, 2006, 9:50 am PDT

05/10 Finding Allene and Mollie, Part 2

Quote From: atzd12

I'm waiting to watch this episode with a knot in my stomach. One of the daughters answering "I don't know" when asked if she wants to live with her mother is so typical of these religious groups. They paint a picture that they're special, they're better than the rest of the world. The rest of the world is full of bad people, dirty people, people with no morals. They did a good job at brainwashing these girls. Trailers are often misleading, it could be I'm interepreting it completely wrong. (I hope I am)! It just strikes a chord with me, because I remember being trapped into that thinking when I was a kid. Looking at it now, from the outside in, I find it deeply disturbing. I'm so out of it now, that sometimes when I talk to family members I'm shocked at how deeply entwined in this way of thinking they still are.

Well actually from my expereince the world IS full of bad people, but there are good people. I am of the idea that young children should only associate with people who are good for them; people who respect them as individuals, who have their best interests at heart, etc...

But as children get older they need to at least be AWARE of the dangers in the world. It doesn't mean they have to experience them, but they need to know how to make good decisions and protect themselves.

In the Father's case I think he just wanted to protect his baby girls from the outside world so he chose to live in a community where he felt they would be most safe. The mother on the other hand believes in allowing the girls to experience the "normal" world.

If the girls chose to live in a PLAIN community for the rest of their lives this wouldn't be an issue, but if they ever decided to live either a plain lifestyle in the "normal" world or give it up all together they would be in danger because they have not had the life expereinces, or haven't been able to make the observations average teenagers in the US have made about "normal" society.

There is nothing wrong with the plain lifestyle if that is a person's choice, or thier parent's joint choice (as long as they are SAFE), but when one parent is not in agreement over that lifestyle (or the person decides tehy don't want to be involved in it anymore)than there are bound to be problems.

Read Replies to this Message

liatsunami

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

May 10, 2006, 4:44 pm PDT

05/10 Finding Allene and Mollie, Part 2

Quote From: ljlu7654

I think this man is a hypocrit! For all of his God fearing ways" and laws, he broke the Law, and took the childrens Mom away from them and lied about her. If given the chance he'd do it again, no doubt. I think he should go to jail for this so that other Fathers, or Mothers don't do this. Brain washing the younger one was wrong, she looks messed up. I hope they throw away the key in court for this guy.

To not allow the children to have education beyond 8th grade is so wrong on all levels, that any one who states this is God's law is just afraid of women and have bought into the ridiculous idea of patriarcal laws that have ruined this country, and caused manind so much misery that I could scream. I hope these girls stay w/the Mom, anything is beter then a jungle and no education..

Thye are NOT old enough to choose perod, and shouldn't be given a choose.They need help too..

::shrugs:: Whatever, thankfully you don't get to decide what happens. I'm not trying to judge these people either way. It's not my job. I was more stating that I can see both perspectives here.

Read Replies to this Message

liatsunami

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

May 16, 2006, 7:01 am PDT

05/16 The Divorce Experiment

I think this guy has alot of growing and changing to do before he DESERVES a wife. No person should have to put up with demeaning remarks and domination by the person that is supposed to LOVE them. I'm not sure what all has happened in this guy's life, but there is a point where you just have to learn to let it go and trust SOMEONE. He doesn't have to be the same person at home as he is in public. In fact in the privacy of his own home it's the PERFECT place for him to let his softer side out. He really needs to get out of his comfort zone.

I think he really hams up the "I'm the man" stuff because he really just doesn't feel all that great about himself in the first place. That's a classic sign of low self esteem. Usually people that put other people down are the people who feel scared or ashamed about something in their lives. I think this guy just doesn't want to admit he has fears, regrets, and other "weak" human emotions.

No matter how much you love someone you should never subject yourself to being demeaned the way Amy has. I hate encouraging people to get a divorce, but I think at least seperating for a time might be beneficial. Greg needs to make some serious changes in his attitudes and behaviors before Amy should consider going back home with him.

Read Replies to this Message

liatsunami

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

May 30, 2006, 4:05 am PDT

05/30 Pretty/Ugly

I couldn't believe that lady with the two girls. She's being so unfair and cruel to that poor little girl. I can't say she's doing the other daughter any favors in the long run either. I can see this pushing them apart as sisters eventually, which is very sad. Not to mention the emotional scarring it's most likely going to at least do to Victoria.

I admit I have an unfair standard myself. I am afraid of having unintelligent children. Which is why I don't have children. I don't think it's fair to have children until I get over that. I wouldn't want to reject my child simply because he/she wasn't "bright". It's sort of strange because when I babysit it doesn't matter to me whether the child is particularly bright or not. I always try to find ways to appreciate what they can do. But I just don't feel I could be that way with my own children. I guess I just feel like with my own children people will look at them if they aren't bright and assume I am a stupid person or a bad mother. The whole idea just freaks me out.

Read Replies to this Message

liatsunami

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

June 3, 2006, 3:03 pm PDT

06/06 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: _marie_

It's not the gayness that makes it a sin folks...it's the lack of love in the union.Loving gay relationships are documented in the Bible.Marie1 Samuel
Chapter 18 1:31 (By the time David finished speaking with Saul, Jonathan had become as fond of David as if his life depended on him; he loved him as he loved himself. 2 Saul laid claim to David that day and did not allow him to return to his father's house. 3 And Jonathan entered into a bond with David, because he loved him as himself.

::scratches head:: Okay, see I always interpreted that passage as saying that David and Johnathon were like brothers, as close as if they were even twins. In fact depending on which translation or version you are reading it does not sound sexual at all.

Not that it really matters to me either way. I personally don't like people looking at religious texts to justify/not justify ANYTHING mostly because a lot of the bible (and other religious texts)is open to so much interpretation. In fact one of the MOST OFTEN misinterpreted passages is the whole Sodom and Gamhorra business. People use that passage all the time to decry homosexuality, when it's actaully about 2 things; 1) the importance of hospitality in a community and 2) rape. It has NOTHING to do with homosexuality if you read it carefully.

As far as Christianity goes most of the stuff referenced against homosexuality is in the OLD TESTEMENT and all good Christians know when Jesus was asked about "the laws" (as in the laws of the old testement) that he pertty much told everyone that they didn't matter. That the only LAW they had to obey was "Love god with all your heart, soul, and mind; and love your neighbor as yourself." Christians learn what god wants through what JESUS actually taught, not what prophets and scribes recorded in the Old Testement. As far as I know Jesus NEVER adressed homosexuality or sex for that matter. Some of his apostles letters do, but again that's their interpretation biased by their own beliefs. So no one can really be sure what Jesus ACTUALLY said about anything. See where I"m going with this?

Read Replies to this Message

liatsunami

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

June 6, 2006, 11:44 am PDT

06/06 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: saltjantn

I have a 19 year old son who seems to be a-sexual. He does not seem to be interested in either boys or girls, and has listed on his website under "sexuality" a question mark. He liked to play with girl toys since he was very young, and now exclusively has girl friends, with not even one male friend. He listens to music which only features female singers. He walks gay, and acts gay, yet swears he is not. Since he clearly does not like men, I wonder if he just may be someone who wants to be a girl. I really don't know what to think but it has become frustrating, not knowing. If he's gay, fine. If he's straight, fine. I believe everyone has to be either way. I have suggested his seeing a psychiatrist and he has refused.

I'm curious as to whether or not anyone else has had a similar problem or any advice you may have.

I actually know 2 grown men who are this way. One of my friend's in college is fairly asexual and so is my boyfriend's brother. They're more intersted in science and video games than sex.

I also had a friend in college we all SWORE up and down was gay by his mannerisms (even though we'd never heard him express sexual interst towards EITHER gender) eventually we got him drinking and he loosened up and we found out he's straight and just likes the attention he gets from acting effeminately. Also he said he finds when girls assume he's gay it puts them more at ease and it's easier to get to know them because they aren't trying to put up a front for him.

Just let it go. Your son may not be comfortable expressing his sexuality even at the age of 19. That's OKAY.

Read Replies to this Message

liatsunami

User Mood
Cranky

Message Emote

June 9, 2006, 3:57 am PDT