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Messages By: blonde_chick

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frustrated
December 20, 2006, 11:37 am PST

Frustrated....

Quote From: gwarrior6

I didn't have a problem with you spreading the message.  What I did take issue with was the way you did it.  I don't think a nonChristian would respond well to paternalistic sermons.  I never said i was okay with her situation, but as Christians, we should use tact.

 

It seemed that you were trying to force something on someone, when that is not the way to recruit anybody.  They have to take Christ into themselves and want to change and transform their lives.

 

I was talking about the marriage thing, because our relationship with Christ is mirrowed in our marital relationships, and also ties into the topic of the show.

 

As a Christian, I'm not "going against you" but merely questioning your approach to the poster as something that would draw her in, or drive her away, and it seemed that it would more likely repel someone, than draw them in.

 

I'm trying to relieve the conflict and make peace, because she is our sister, and the peace leads her to us.

I find it annoying when others say "God wants you to do this".  You do not know that for sure, you really do not.  Living together before marriage has got to be one of the smartest ways to go about it.  Of course not for EVERYONE, some people will disagree of course.  It is important to do what is right for YOU and your partner.  But it seems these days we have evolved, and evolving is fantastic.  Change is a good thing, it helps us grow and mature.  People who cannot see that have very closed minds.  Not living together before marriage is a thing of the past.  We have evolved to recognize that moving in together and then getting married if both people see fit, is definitely the way to go. 

 

What if you get married and once you are living together you cannot stand eachother?  I'm not talking about minor problems that can be solved, or even major problems that can be solved.  You could realize you've made an awful mistake.  Why not realize that before you walk down the isle?  Be smart!  Check out your options before marriage. 

 

I'm not saying everyone should live together before marriage.  I just don't think it's right to say that that is wrong "according to God".  I don't care if you do not live together before, so you should not care if I do.

 

Don't even get me started on the "no sex before marriage" nonsense.  Wow.  I can't even imagine how many people get married only to realize there is nothing there physically....

 

Anyway, do what is right for you, but saving big events until after marriage, in my opinion, is asking for trouble.

 

 

 
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surprised
December 22, 2006, 8:40 am PST

Seriously?

Quote From: gwarrior6

If you get to know the person before you live with them, then you can work out the kinks when you live together.  It's about loving the person before you commit to sharing your lives together.

 

There are warning signs that red flag that you probably shouldn't marry that person.  And if you "try before you buy" so to speak, i think it creates the atmosphere where the guy has all the benefits of marriage, but without the commitment, which might be what the woman wants.  It sets up the woman to be manipulated and having the "marriage" carrot dangled in front of her.

 

If i believe it's "wrong according to God" i have every right to say it, because i believe it.  You might not, but it's your life.

You can't be serious!  "It creates the atmosphere where the guy has all the benefits of marriage, but without the commitment".  What???  Commitment can be marriage, or it can be living together or you can be just as committed and not even live together yet!  It is what it is for you.  I know that I am just as committed right now to my long-term boyfriend (yes, we live together and it's wonderful) as I would be if we got married.  I will feel no more committed the day I marry him compared to what I feel now.  I love him, respect him, we have faith and trust in eachother.  I do believe in marriage, but I'd rather spend my money on buying our new condo (which we just did) and going on vacations together, or with friends, and just having fun together while we are still young (mid 20's).  We are extremely committed, and that committment will remain, whether we are married or not. 

 

And why is it always the guys that get accused of reaping benefits, how do you know the women don't do the same??  That statement that I put in quotes at the beginning of my post is just so comical to me.  It truly makes no sense!  Can't women have all the benefits of marriage "without the commitment"???  What does that even mean anyway? 

 

That's great that you feel you know what god thinks is "right" and what he thinks is "wrong."  Personally, I do what is right for me in my life, and clearly you will too and that is fine.  But times have changed, so you may want to consider changing with them, but that is totally up to you.

 
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blank
December 28, 2006, 12:06 pm PST

Shag up....haha

Quote From: bnaito

It is sad that many couples today shag up and never take that important step to make their relationship permanent and official. In many cases, men are coming up with excuses that they are not ready, yet they are ready at any time to jump in bed and create a child.  In their minds, they think that since they get what they want, why should they need to get into a deeper commitment to get the same that they already have. And for women, they say, someday, someday it will happen.....Hello, wake up!! They are very selfish and they don't take their children's welfare and sense of security seriously. It is time to say, I'm leaving to start a new life if you are not commited. Let the other show their true self by either come clean with their commitment or show that they don't have what it takes to make a commited relationship.

The phrase "shag up" is always made to sound so bad and wrong.  Living together before marriage can be a wonderful thing people!  Just do what is right for you.  To me, committment is important, whether I am married to him or not.  He feels the same, so we are good.  I would be so upset with myself while walking down the isle knowing that my relationship didn't play out the way I wanted it to before marriage.  I would feel I would be more likely to divorce, because how can I just assume I want to live with this person forever without doing it before entering marriage?  I know that others feel it is better to marry first and then try living together, but to me, that makes ZERO sense.....
 
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giddy
December 28, 2006, 12:07 pm PST

Debate...

Quote From: purplepenny

I agree about getting things in writing, I was merely pointing out the irony  in your posts.

And do you have stats on divorce rates and living together first? (I always need proof, I'm not going to just believe things because someone tells me, I am skeptical of all stats that are thrown out there.)

All of the stats I have ever read say that Christian have the highest rate of divorce and they are the ones who are loudest against living together first.

Also, is this study that comes up with this stat something that takes into account WHEN the marriage started? Because to compare marriages that started decades ago, to fresher marriages makes no sense. There is a social pressure that no longer exists upon staying married, happy or not. Also, the shift in sexual politics has created an environment where women are no longer there to simply make a man happy. Now you need TWO happy people in the marriage. Not just the penis carrier. This is much more difficult to maintain. 

My mom and dad have been married for almost 28 years...that's impressive, but the fact that both people in the marriage are working only towards my fathers happiness makes it a much simpler union than my marriage, where both of us are trying to find a balance between personal happiness and the happiness of our union.

So I would have to read this study to see how it's done. I can give you a link to the study I have about Christian divorce rates being higher if you'd like.
Hmm, seems I'm started quite the debate....
 
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anxious
December 28, 2006, 12:12 pm PST

Worth the wait???

Quote From: jettav

 And it is worth the wait. Good for you
Worth the wait????  Not so much....no way!
 
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naughty
December 28, 2006, 1:43 pm PST

Ha!

Quote From: gwarrior6

So, are you saying she should lower her standards and marry just anybody?  Or were you alluding to the no sex before marriage thing?  For some ppl it IS worth it to take things slower and fall in love with someone, not just their penis.  People CAN have meaningful romantic relationships without sex, and it's better I think to work on the relationship.  So if you withhold sex, does that mean the person doesn't love you anymore, uh, NO!  Or at least it shouldn't affect the way someone feels about you.

 

 

Of course she should NOT lower her standards.  I just find the thought of committing yourself into a marriage without knowing everything about one another is foolish.  Believe me, I do not take sex lightly.  I do not think, as you said, witholding sex means the person doesn't love you, of course not.  You are right, it should not affect the way someone feels about you.  But let's be REALISTIC, shall we?  Sex is an extremely imporant part of a marriage, and any committed relationship.  It is a personal, but important aspect of things.  Deciding to commit yourseves to one another forever under the eyes of god and in front of family, friends, etc., BEFORE having the most intamte moments?  INSANITY!!!

 

 
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chillin'
December 29, 2006, 8:43 am PST

Agree with Penny...

Quote From: gwarrior6

What do fundamental changes have to do with how much you love someone?  If youre in love with someone, why is it integral to you to have to agree on everything?  I see the world differently than my spouse, but does that mean i have to be miserable because of it?  No, I learn from his point of view.  That's why i enjoy confrontation (can't you tell?), it teaches me things i would have never known otherwise. 

 

I can love my husband, but not love his point of view, while still respecting it.  Why can't marriages last to the end?  The happiest ppl in marriage are older ppl who have been married forever (i know there was a study done on spousal happiness at certain times in the marriage, but i can't recall exactly where i saw this).  It makes me wonder how happy i would be if i bother to work on it that long-that's committment for ya.

As usual, I agree with Penny.  I feel that we tend to see things in the same light.  She never said it was integral to her to have to agree on everything.  She said NOTHING of the sort.  But there are most definitely areas where you can't be 100% opposite.  Her example was perfect.  Now how on earth can a couple be happy together with one who has strong religious beliefs, and the other is athiest?  What if a child was brought into the world on those terms?  How would they raise this child?  Could you imagine the pain and suffering everyone would have to endure because these two people "see the word differently."  It's so much more than that in many cases!!!!  THINK ABOUT IT!!!!!!
 
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December 29, 2006, 10:13 am PST

Are you for real?

Quote From: gwarrior6

 No example is perfect.  If anything, a child brought into a situation where there are two different beliefs would have the benefit of two different viewpoints.  Think about that.

 

Why is it that you can't have fundamental differences with someone and still love them for who they are.  Who they are hasn't really changed, just how they see the world.  It seems like she was saying that if you have MASSIVE differences, yo u can't EVER reconcile them.

 

I remember from my Developmental Psychology class (I don't remember which book off hand, but if you google it, you can find anything) about diferent stages in marriage and the happiness levels according to milestones (having children, empty nesting, etc.).

 

There are always ways to respect fundamental differences without losing love and respect for someone.

You can't be serious?!  Yes, in a perfect world, two people's viewpoints would be ever so beneficial and children would grow up so informed and whatnot.  Yes, and everything would be rainbows and butterflies all the time.  Get with it!  At some point you need to be realistic.  There are not "always ways" around things.  Sometimes you just need to let go and move on so you can be happy!
 
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December 29, 2006, 12:39 pm PST

Classic example

Quote From: gwarrior6

These are the sources I've found for the U curve of happiness in marital duration:

 

Van Laningham, Jody "Marital Happiness, Marital Duration, and the U-Shaped Curve: Evidence from a Five-Wave Panel Study"
Social Forces - Volume 79, Number 4, June 2001, pp. 1313-1341
The University of North Carolina Press

 

Orbach, Terri L., House, James, Mero, Richard, "Marital Quality Over the Life Course", Social Psycology Quarterly-June 1996 American Socialogical Association, Washington DC

You seem to be a classic example of someone who believes everything they read.  Open your mind.  Be realistic.  Stop with the "research".  Use common sense instead.
 
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hopeful
January 4, 2007, 9:37 am PST

Agreed

Quote From: gwarrior6

This is just a suggestion, so take it or leave it.  I think your stepson is still grieving for his mom.  You can't put a time limit on grieving.  It's not a good idea to discipline him for his bad behavior-leave that to his dad.  You have to understand that he just experienced a major loss in his life and doesn't know how to cope with it.  Since he's a minor, it makes it even harder for him to accept.

The more you harp on how he should "get over it", the more he's going to resent you.  Stand back, let him grieve, and listen to him if he wants to talk to you.  Try to get his aunt to visit as much as she can (when she's not on the road).  Also, it wouldn't be a bad idea to get him some counseling and let his dad take him to visit his mom's grave when he wants, and encourage talk about his mom.  Just a thought.

I agree.  You need to let him grieve in his very own way.  Whatever it may be.  Counselling is probably best.  Just be there to listen and understand.  It may take some time, more time than you think it should.  But it's not up to you....

 

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