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Messages By: willowtree07

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March 21, 2007, 1:10 am CDT

Understanding

I can't believe after reading all these messages that this is the type of people who watch Dr.Phil. I can at least try to be understanding, to empathize, and be compassionate to people even when they are doing something I don't agree with or like.

It feels like alot of the people posting on here are writing to just write, not being helpful to the couples at all.  If you want to be mean, find another outlet for your hostility. Obviously people only come on the Dr. Phil show as a very last resort. They are at their wits end and are reaching out frantically for help. In order to get that help they are willing to humilate themselves on national tv, and tell the world about their deepest personal and normally private problems in the desperate hope that maybe, just maybe, someone will care enough about them as human beings to offer the help and compassion they so deeply need.

The reason that Karrie spends hours talking to her friend instead of her husband is that he has tuned out of the relationship. Its a strong characteristic of  addiction, being disconnected emotionally for others...ect. Its not that she doesn't want to talk to her husband, its that he doesn't want to talk to her. Or Ben can't let down his barriers enough to talk with his wife, yet.

 

Yes, sexual addiction is a label that all too quickly becomes an excuse, but that doesn't make it any less of an actual addiction.

 

The reason that many cheaters stay with their spouses, is they are waiting for a better  "deal" to come along before they finally leave their wife/husband. Is that what is happening in these two couples marriages? I hope not, but I fear its true.

 

I believe that both of the men have redeeming qualities that can help them through these times, but they have to want to change. They must take ownership and responsibilty for their behavior. Yes, an addiction makes it alot harder to resist the "urges". BUT being addicted does not give you free license to indulge your sex drive. 

I understand all too well how hard it is to resist addiction as I myself am addicted to many different things. I know what its like to try and try, but fail miserably. I honestly feel that the only path to being free of addictions of all types is to want that freedom first, and then to pray. Work on yourself every day, give it up to God, but don't give up.

 
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confused
March 21, 2007, 11:24 am CDT

03/20 "I Hate This Marriage"

Quote From: livvygirl

I have news for you ironsides - sexual release affects EVERYONE's brain!  That's part of the reason we enjoy it.  Sex is not a chemically manufactured addictive substance like cocaine or heroin.  It is a normal, natural, enjoyable PART of life.  The only difference I can see between a "sex addict" and the rest of the world is that most of us know there is a time and place for sexual behavior, and sometimes we've just got to keep it in our pants and say NO - "sex addicts" don't seem to want to realize that.  So to them, I say "GROW UP!!!"  You need something to do with your hands?  Take up golf.

How does verbally attacking someone who is asking for help, help them? What they need is patience, compassion and someone to say " I understand your hurting, let me tell you how I recieved help for this same problem" or something along those lines.

 

When you look at sex as something more then the physical release, and you use it to escape from reality on a regular basis you might have a problem. When you have sex with anything with two legs and a heartbeat, in the hope of deadening your pain you might have a problem. When you would rather masturbate then have sex with your very willing, and attractive spouse you might have a problem. When you "need" to have sexual encounters with multiple people daily, just to get through the day then you might have a problem. You might be a sex addict. You might need alot of counseling, but you will definetly need somone with compassion yet a tough love manner too.

 

It is very easy for many people who are on the outside to say that the wives should just leave their husbands and that they are making the wrong choice to stay. But its much harder to fight for a marriage and a spouse, to make a stand and say " This person is a child of God, they deserve for someone to care enough to help" The help can be many things including inpatient treatment, counseling, seperation or divorce. Sometimes, it does take divorce before a sex addict will hit rock bottom. Sometimes it takes being arrested during a prostitution sting before they hit  bottom. No one but the addict themselves can say when they are truely ready to recieve the help that is being offered, however, it is our responsibilty as caring human beings to have it avilable for them.

 
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frustrated
March 21, 2007, 7:22 pm CDT

03/20 "I Hate This Marriage"

Quote From: livvygirl

It is not an "attack" to DISAGREE!!!  These men who claim to be sex addicts are "hurting"?  I beg to differ.  Seems to me they're the only ones having a good time!  There getting to indulge their desires anywhere, anytime, at the expense of their wives and families, and get to present themselves to the world as VICTIMS who deserve sympathy!  Such a deal!  Where's does the "hurt" come in?  Their wives sure are hurting.  Their kids are hurting.  But that doesn't matter to the excuse-makers and enablers, does it?

You say "these men" who claim to be sex addicts, but I have news for you. Women can and are sexual addicts just as much as men are. This show in particular only focused on men, but believe me, the women who suffer sexual addiction are out there in force.

Yes, those who suffer from any form of addiction are in serious inner pain. I can't believe you don't even attempt to understand. And yes, the family also suffers. But I believe for a great many of the sexual addicts out there its not about desires, its about trying desperatly to fill a deep dark hole inside themselves to make them feel like they are human, that they exist, that they are worthy of love. True this is not the actual way to get love and compassion, but when your sick inside and addicted to a specific pattern of behaviors, you can't seem to break free from the same set of behaviors. Whether its eating at the same fast food restaurant everyday, and crying in the car while berating yourself for overeating, whether its going to seedy sex shops and masturbating in a booth while your wife waits at home wondering where you are ( and you know she is, but you can't stop doing it), wether its an  drug addict grabbing a quick snort in the restroom at work during lunch break, hoping no one will walk in and find them....its all the same underlying issue. Some how at some point, an addictive tendency was let into their lives. They aren't being fulfilled emotionally, or physically or whatever, and instead of addressing the true deep issues,  they continue to do the addiction.

I know because I suffer from a few different addiction myself. I know that its destroying my life, and that its only a matter of time before I get caught. I've tried to stop, managed a few months, but I find myself doing other things that are just as bad to fill that gap. The only way to healing is to lay in God's hands, to accept the responsibility for my own actions and to try to move on in my life. I'm nowhere near  healed yet, but I know about the pain and the denial and the shame.

 
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March 21, 2007, 7:29 pm CDT

03/20 "I Hate This Marriage"

Quote From: flrat69

I have to honestly say I don't know the answer to this one.  Perhaps a starting point would be to define addiction.  I think we overuse the term.  I also believe there are two general types of addictions.  Those are the physical addictions in which the body has developed a need for whatever it may be and psychological addictions in which the true problem is a compulsive disorder.  I think most people have neither of these, but I have known people who I do feel had an unnatural obsession with sex to the point that it dominated almost everything they did.  Then were in a very gray area in which it is hard to determine who has a problem obsession and who is claiming it as an excuse. 

 

In a case such as the man on the program, I would be more comfortable had he been evaluated by a professional to make a determination of which group into which he fell.  One of the reasons I say this is that he had to know about the huge financial hole he was digging.  That leads me to at least question whether his judgment is being over ridden by his obsession.

 

The problem for me is that I find your argument to be persuasive as well.  I too am tired of people blaming bad behavior on yet one more disorder.  If he is sincere, one thing he can do right now is to cut up all credit cards and take his name off any joint accounts.

 

My last thought is that everyone seems to forget the culpability of the wife.  She opened this Pandora's box by pushing aberrant sexual behavior to begin with.  She has no claim as an innocent victim in my book.  By their own statements, he was not like this until she pushed "alternative sexual practices" on him.  She changed and then became appalled by what she herself had created.

 

If it doesn't change, I feel for the daughters because of both of them.

About the culpability of the wife in that segment, you forget that the husband spoke about being given porn as a 5 year old from a neighbor and that he said something about struggling with this for years. Yes the wife was the sexual aggressor in the begining and though the husband states that he wanted a "semi-traditional relationship"or something along those lines, I don't buy it for a second. True that the wife has grown up and matured in her view on life, and turned away from the things that were destructive in their partnership, but the husband isn't there yet and hasn't been willing to truely try yet. That is the true problem in their relationship. She grew out of the need to prove love with sex, and he can't stop his addiction even though he knows it could end up killing her.

Which brings me to another semi related point, she needs to get tested ASAP. However, have you ever taken twin babies who are being breastfed every 2-3 hours (probably, if done right should be that often) to the crowded smelly, dirty, county health department? I don't know if the husband was working at the time, but I think its pretty hard to get a babysitter for twins so Mommy can go get checked for stds.  Anyway, is there someone who lives in their area maybe who can meet them and offer them babysitting for a few hours so she can get checked out before its too late?

 
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hopeful
March 21, 2007, 7:41 pm CDT

03/20 "I Hate This Marriage"

Quote From: bmk1968

 

Ben mentioned that he was given pornography as a young child.  That is a form of child abuse.  We know how distructive pornography is to an adult mind, imagine how distorted the thoughts and mental images children would have over time.  It is a form of mental conditioning.  

 

I also notice the oversexualization of  teenagers and people in their 20's.  They are bombarded with images and messages of detached sexuality on television shows, movies and advertisements.  I think we need to understand how these behaviors are formed for treatment and prevention.

I agree wholeheartedly! There is a serious epidemic out there where sex is no longer a "big deal". You hear about teens and PRE-teens having oral sex in the back of school buses and in class. They say "hey, no biggie, just friends with benifits" At that age they are to immature to understand that they are setting themselves up for a life time of worry about stds as well as emotional problems. Feeling inadequate, shamed, hurt, confused, these teens are turning to drugs, huffing and alchol at record numbers. Why isn't America concerned enough about this? Mainly because its still more prevelant in the minority communities, because its harder to tell that your upper middle class child is huffing household cleaners or stealing a swallow of your cognac. Its harder to tell until your child comes home pregnant, drunk, high or doesn't come home at all.

These children are who will be your Doctors, your therapists, your dentists, your leaders when you are old and grey think about that one!  Who will care for you in the nursing home? These children if they get a chance to grow up, will be the future population. We need to care enough about them to stand up and shout " This is not acceptable! This is not right!  You are worth more then this! You deserve a better life!!!!!" They need people who don't just lecture them, but people who listen who understand and who care.

(Jumping off my social commentary soapbox now)  :)

 
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March 22, 2007, 11:30 am CDT

03/20 "I Hate This Marriage"

Quote From: search4truth

The first step you took is that you know the SHAME you are doing to you and your family!

Please try to seek out some help for yourself.......Don't hurt your love ones any more!

I wish you luck!

Actually I'm single, and live alone so I dont have to worry about the shame affecting family, husband or children. I suppose that also makes it harder for me to seek out help. Because I keep telling myself that I am only hurting myself, and so many parts of society don't even see it as an issue. Its considered socially acceptable by most, at least to some degree, probably not to the extent I abuse it.

I acknowledge that I have chosen to do behaviors that are negativly affecting my daily mental wellbeing and my life. I know that at some point I need to make that choice to seek help, and be commited to overcoming these addictions. I'm just not at that point yet, I don't think. I can only pray about it, and wait until I am ready for help.

 
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March 22, 2007, 11:38 am CDT

03/20 "I Hate This Marriage"

Quote From: jaam04

I cried through most of the show because I am dealing with a similar situation.  I don't think it got (or has gotten yet) to their point (paying for strippers and sleeping around) but I'm scared to death that it will lead to that if he doesn't get help.  I actually found out about my husbands addiction to porn one week before I was scheduled give birth to our twins.  I can't even describe my feelings from then on.  This was a total shocker to me and has ruined me in so many ways after that day.  He begged and cried that he would not do it again and he seemed so sincere.  I never got over it but I gave him another chance.  Well, exactly one year later I caught him with porn again.  I packed some backs and was about to leave and that's when he had a breakdown and said that he would get help or do whatever it took for me to stay.  Well, he took one baby step and started going to church but that didn't last long.  I know he still needs help but don't know where to start and I know I need help too because I am more and more depressed everyday. :(  So, watching this show truely hit home.

I am so sorry to hear about your and your husbands situation. At this point, you can only do one thing, get help for yourself. I think one of the other posters on here has written about al-anon or similar groups for those who live with addicts.

 I really think that just for your mental well being, you should see a counselor or a support group. Don't let what happened to those couples happen to you. You have a right to stand up and make a choice. And you have the right to seek help dealing with this until you make that choice. There are many support groups and books, that will help you be strong enough to make the right one for you and your twins. 

 
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happy
March 22, 2007, 11:42 am CDT

03/20 "I Hate This Marriage"

Quote From: flrat69

Your post was well thought through.  I agree about the testing, especially where the children are concerned.

Aww, thanks! You boosted me when I could really use it!  :)

Its really hard to read all these stories on here, and know that aside from speaking from past experiences and urging others to get help, there isn't anything I can do to help them.

I'm not a trained pro, I'm just a jane doe, but occasionally I have good opinions and maybe good advice.

Thanks again, you brightened my day!  :) :)

 

 
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March 22, 2007, 11:44 am CDT

in reference to OldIronSides

Quote From: flrat69

My only question is whether you know him personally.  No offense is intended there.  You just seem to imply inside knowledge.

Your message here is to oldironsides, but based on the previous posts from this user I would hazard a guess that he is the man from the first part of the show or someone posing as him?

 

 

Quote From: oldironsides

The man has been evaulated by more than one professional and it was recommended that he seek in patient treatment for sex addiction.  He was also sexually addicted before he met his wife, she just fed the addiction until she decided to go a different path.  The credit cards are gone and there are no joint accounts.  My only question is whether you know him personally.  No offense is intended there.  You just seem to imply inside knowledge.
 
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worried
March 22, 2007, 11:50 am CDT

03/20 "I Hate This Marriage"

Quote From: search4truth

I know all about the books and places you have talked about.....and they are a GREAT help!

Again Dr. Phil you have the POWER to make a difference to the WOMEN and MEN out there!

DO YOU HEAR OUR CRY FOR HELP! 

I don't think that Dr. Phil personally has the time to read each and every message on these boards. I know I am writing 10 a day minimum, so there must be many hundreds of messages posted on his boards daily about a great number of different topics and shows. I do hope that the moderators and the staff that work behind the scenes to keep these boards up and running do take the time to read these, and maybe pass on that the people of america have some deep concerns about our children, the rampant immorality and about the future.
 

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