Messages By: jkforrest

from: jkforrest

Iwas late to pick up grandchildren to keep them while their mother and aunt (my oldest) were packing and moving March of 2004. Mother of grandchildren was ok and loading car seats when my oldest daughter verbally attacked me regarding my lateness. Response was this :it

is between their mother and I not you. Daughter comes back in and my statments is "sorry I made your day a living nightmare". Immediately started apoligizing for my tone and statement as i was very upset at the attack. Mother of children said (quite reasonable) you are not going

to talk to me in that tone. However, she jumped outside onto the patio as I was apologizing

and trying to explain the verbal attack resulting in me being upset that her sister started as soon as she was our of earshot. She promtly removed the car seats and would not allow grandchildren to leave with me. Oldest daughter has not spoken to me since.

However, it was difficult to see children after that we were occasional allowed. Last seeing them Christmas Eve of 2004. Once for 15 minutes in May of 2005 at which time she swept them supposedly to dance class immediately, (they never made it). Then I received a warrant within a few days (restraing order not to come near them). I was shocked !!

Cliff notes version:went to court June 2005 and judge told her there was absouletly nothing I had done to provoke this and she would have to pay court costs in regard to this. Note: she starts with this sentence "Well I probably won't have a mother after this but I never did". I never said one word during the entire experience. She was very emotional and almost crying. Stated on warrant I was emotionally and physically abusive during childhood into adulthood and she was afraid for her family especially her children.   Important note!!!!:  Not so-had been keeping children at their prior house, then apt. one or more days a week (45miles one way) at no charge just because I  wan't to be part of their lives. Took trip to west coast and Mexico in car with friend and purchased numerous items to decorate their apt and new house(she ask me to help her decide on flooring lighting etc.)and mailed what would not fit in car. Cards from both daughters in safe deposit box stating how much they appreciated me and their step father etc. and all we had done(bought furniture, moved back home during divorce, gave money, gifts, sent them on trips,  bought cars for them as single mom at 16 yrs for each,took them on trips-ie very normal childhood things).  Helped her to adopt oldest daughter.

NOW

judge states obviously she does not want to speak to you do you understand? I knod my head yes. We continue to send cards, presents to chldren at holidays and birthdays. She and especially SISTER especially expound to be Christians!!!and go to church. That day when we saw them for 15 min. stopped to speak to her pastor re: mediating to reach some understanding and he agreed to pray regarding this and to give them time. That has been over one year. Granddaughter has started to school for the second year without me seeing them. I am devistated and don't know what else to do except pray for them both to have an open heart to allow God to speak to each of their hearts and let them know family is important. Will anyone

that reads this please pray regarding this as My recent note card to them said "I am extending the olive branch to stop this silience between us. I am not perfect however, God accepts me as I am and continest o love me anyway. Please allow us to hear from you and enjoy you and our grandchildren in our "golden years" as they say! Judy in TN Please need help or advise at wits end!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DEAR WIFEY31,

I AM SORRY TO BURST YOUR BUBBLE OF "FAMILY" IN ABUSE SITUATIONS THERE IS SELDOM ANY "FAMILY" TO COMFORT YOU. I TOO WAS ABUSED BY AN UNCLE AND

A GROUP OF OTHERS FOR YEARS.SRA. I NEVER TOLD TILL I WAS GROWN AND ON

MY SECOND MARRIAGE. AT THIS TIME I FELT SAFE ENOUGH TO CONFRONT MY MOTHER

AS SHE NOT MY FATHER HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH THIS. ALL THREE YOUNG SISTER'S

BELIEVED ME AND WERE VERY VERY SORRY UNTIL I CONFRONTED MY MOTHER WITH

HER PART IN THE ABUSE. THAT WAS MARCH 22, 1992. MOTHER WAS VERY CALM AND

NEVER ADMITTED ANYTHING, DAD WAS RUNNING AROUND LIKE A CHICKEN WITH HIS

HEAD CUT OFF AND MY THREE YOUNGER SISTERS WERE FURIOUS AND ONE TRIED

TO THROW A KITCHEN TABLE AT ME. HAVEN;T SPOKEN TO THEM SINCE AT THEIR REQUEST!  LUCKY FOR ME AND YOU IS THAT MY HUSBAND & YOURS KNOWS THE TRUTH .MINE HAS SEEN  ME THROUGH SOME VERY VERY ROCKY TIMES.  YOU HAVEN'T

MENTIONED ANYTHING ABOUT THERAPY. I AM A TYPE A PERSONALITY AND THOUGHT

I WOULD JUST GUT IT OUT AND BE DONE WITH IT. SORRY VERY SORRY TO REPORT IT

JUST DOESN'T HAPPEN THAT WAY UNFORTUNTELY. SINCE YOUR HUSBAND IS YOUR

GREATEST ADVOCATE, I SUGGEST YOU AND PERHAPS HE LATER WITH YOU GO TO

THERAPY, A TRUSTED PASTOR (HOWEVER MINE OCCURED AT CHURCH), RABBI OR

A RAPE CRISIS SETTING TO ASK FOR HELP. TRUST ME WHEN I SAY THIS IT WILL NOT

GO AWAY WITHOUT WORKING VERY DILEGENTLY AT THIS MONSTER FOR SOME TIME!!!

IT WILL AFFECT YOUR MARRIAGE, FRIENDSHIPS, OBVIOUSLY FAMILY AND ESPICELLY

CHILDREN IF YOU HAVE ANY OR INTEND TO IN THE FUTURE. REMEMBER NOW THAT

-------IT-----------IS OUT OF THE BAG IT WILL BE LIKE A SHIRT OR BLOUSE YOU CAN NEVER

QUITE GET IT BACK INTO THE PLASTIC THE SAME WAY IT CAME OUT NOW MATTER HOW

HARD YOU TRY UNLESS, OF COURSE, YOU KNEW YOU WERE GOING TO HAVE TO DO THAT BEFORE YOU TOOK IT OUT!  BY YOUR OWN WORDS YOU CERTAINLY DIDN'T THINK

YOU WOULD HAVE TOO AND I TRULY DO UNDERSTAND THAT I PROMISE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I AM SO SORRY FOR YOUR PAIN AND TELLING YOU IT WILL GET BETTER WON'T HELP YOU

RIGHT NOW. BUT PLEASE KNOW THERE ARE MILLIONS OF US OUT THERE FOR YOU TO

TALK TO. I KNOW I WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO TALK TO YOU OFF THE BOARDS BY

EMAIL OR THE PHONE. USUALLY THE CITY YOU LIVE IN HAS A SUPPORT GROUP YOU

COULD START GOING TO, WHICH I FOUND INVALUABLE BECAUSE ONLY ANOTHER PERSON THAT HAS WALKED IN YOUR SHOES CAN UNDERSTAND EVEN A WORD OF WHAT

YOU ARE FEELING EVEN THOUGH THERAPISTS ARE TRAINED IT'S NOT THE SAME UNLESS THEY TOO WERE ABUSED. ABOVE ALL REMEMBER IT'S NOT THE AMOUNT OF TIMES IT HAPPENED, IT'S THE FACT IT HAPPENED AT ALL.   YOU NOR ANYONE DESERVES THIS.  I STILL AM ASTOUNDED IT CONTINUES TO HAPPEN & THE VICTUM IS USUALLY BLAMED AND BECOMES THE OUTCAST OF THE "FAMILY" BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT TO

"DEAL" WITH THE FALL OUT IF THEY ACTUALLY DEALT WITH THE ABSUER AS THEY SHOULD.

GOD BLESS YOUR HUSBAND BECAUSE HE WAS PUT IN YOUR LIFE FOR A REASON, AND I

BELIEVE ONE OF THOSE REASONS IS TO HELP YOU HEAL FROM THIS. I WISH YOU STRENGTH, LOVE, HOPE AND RELIEF FROM YOUR PAIN   JKFORREST

YES BY ALL MEANS TELL YOUR MOTHER. A DREAM CAN'T HURT ANYONE. DYING FROM

SOMETHING THAT COULD HAVE BEEN PREVENTED WILL. I WOULD NOT BE OVERLY

ALARMED, HOWEVER, AFTER SAYING THAT IF YOUR MOTHER HAS NOT HAD A

COLONOSCOPY (LIKE KATIC COURIC ON THE TODAY SHOW" SHE SHOULD OR AT THE

VERLY LEAST VISIT A DOCTOR AND DISCUSS IT WITH HIM ESPECIALLY IF SHE IS NEAR

FIFTY.  REMEMBER THE SAYING"BETTER SAFE THAN SORRY" I SUGGEST THIS APPLIES

HERE. A VISIT TO THE DOCTOR FOR INFORMATION CERTAINLY WOULD BE HELPFUL.

I HOPE THIS HAS BEEN OF SOME HELP AS IT IS WHAT I WOULD DO. JK FORREST

 I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT TO TELL YOU EXCEPT I AM VERY VERY SORRY FOR YOUR PAIN. I TOO HAVE TWO DAUGHTERS 40 AND 41 AND THEY LIVE ABOUT 50 MILES FROM ME. I

HAVE TWO GRANDCHILDREN THAT I HAVE NOT BE ALLOWED TO SEE SINCE CHRISTMAS

EVE OF 2004. THIS I FIND TO BE MORE PAINFUL OF THE TWO SITUATIONS. MY HUSBAND

(NOT THEIR FATHER EVEN THOUGH THEY LIKE HIM BETTER) SEND BIRTHDAY CARDS

FAIRLY GENERIC NOT TO MUSHY, HOLIDAY AND CHRISTMAS HOPING SOMEDAY THEY

WILL CHANGE THEIR MINDS. MY HUSBAND SAYS IT'S BECAUSE THEY ARE SPOILED BRATS AND NOW I TEND TO AGREE. THEY ARE GOING TO PUNISH YOU, OR PERHAPS

AND I KNOW YOU DON'T WANT TO HEAR THIS-FORGET YOU AND MOVE ON WITH THEIR

LIVES. I HAVE BEEN TOLD TO DO THE SAME, HOWEVER, IT IS VERY VERY PAINFUL. I DO

PRAY THEY WILL HAVE THEIR HEARTS OPENED TO LET GOD IN TO DO THE WORK THAT

NEEDS TO BE DONE AND BELIEVE THIS IS ALL WE CAN DO AT THIS TIME. WOULD BE GLAD

TO TALK OFF BOARDS BY EMAIL OR PHONE TO CONSOLE EACH OTHER OR PERHAPS MAKE SOME OTHER STRATEGY IF YOU THINK THAT WOULD BE HELP FULL. CK JK FORREST

HOPE YOU HAVE SEEN YOUR GRANDCHILDREN BY NOW I STILL HAVE NOT. ANY

NEWS WOULD BE HELPFUL. JKFORREST

 Re: 09/14 Saboteurs

I too have not seen my two grandchildren since Christmas Eve of 2004. Soon to be  three years. I just

want to talk and work things out "what ever that is". I don't believe the children should be made to suffer

just because my daughter is mad about something. It surely doesnt' show love, forgiveness or respect

for your mother. Plus we don't even not WHY she is mad.  

I noticed you said court order. Do you mind me asking what state you live in as I don't believe TN has

any recourse for us in the court system. 

JKForrest

Actually I wasn't sure if you were responding to my post or not due to the content of your post. I had to

research to be sure before I tried to respond regarding my post and your comments due to it. I believe you may be projecting somethings from your life experiences and not my specific post or perhaps I did not articulate the last part well. Regardless of what you THINK you read perhaps you might want to re read

my post. I did not include but will now. I have NEVER tried to interfere with my daughter's parenting skills as I raised her and believe it is now her job to do the best she can. Nor have I tried to raise my grandchildren. I DON"T believe it is anyone's right to tell another person how to live their life or how to raise their children period. I am just a loving grandmother wanting contact with my grandchildren and their mother as well. As I believe you must start there with a good relationship if you are to continue to see the ENTIRE family! You must have dialogue before you can resolve any issue. However, as I indicated my loss of not seeing my grandchildren for several yrs. is very distressiing. My question as to court/legal/government etc.grandparents rights was a question just that and nothing more period!  I never said I intended to take anything to the legal system. Involving the courts or lawyers usually does nothing except give the courts something to do and line the lawyers pockets. I question why it appears to me that you are lashing out at me for some perceived course of action I never even suggested I would take.  I, my

husband, my friends and even a therapist are stumped at her behavior however, it is my belief that only continued prayer will bring her around to having contact. That, of course, is only our opinions. I am saddened that you chose to direct your rant regarding "rights" towards my post as it contained nothing regarding either the MIL or DIL. However I will say they both need to grow up.This is about the grandchildren's love and care and not about THEIR egos!!!!!!! I doubt I will use this message board again as I find it not very helpfull only people taking sides regarding peoples lives from an edited glimpse of one hour. That could hardly put anyone in the expert chair to tell anyone what they should or should not be doing as I said earlier.

Actually I wasn't sure if you were responding to my post or not due to the content of your post. I had to

research to be sure before I tried to respond regarding my post and your comments due to it. I believe you may be projecting somethings from your life experiences and not my specific post or perhaps I did not articulate the last part well. Regardless of what you THINK you read perhaps you might want to re read

my post. I did not include but will now. I have NEVER tried to interfere with my daughter's parenting skills as I raised her and believe it is now her job to do the best she can. Nor have I tried to raise my grandchildren. I DON"T believe it is anyone's right to tell another person how to live their life or how to raise their children period. I am just a loving grandmother wanting contact with my grandchildren and their mother as well. As I believe you must start there with a good relationship if you are to continue to see the ENTIRE family! You must have dialogue before you can resolve any issue. However, as I indicated my loss of not seeing my grandchildren for several yrs. is very distressiing. My question as to court/legal/government etc.grandparents rights was a question just that and nothing more period!  I never said I intended to take anything to the legal system. Involving the courts or lawyers usually does nothing except give the courts something to do and line the lawyers pockets. I question why it appears to me that you are lashing out at me for some perceived course of action I never even suggested I would take.  I, my

husband, my friends and even a therapist are stumped at her behavior however, it is my belief that only continued prayer will bring her around to having contact. That, of course, is only our opinions. I am saddened that you chose to direct your rant regarding "rights" towards my post as it contained nothing regarding either the MIL or DIL. However I will say they both need to grow up.This is about the grandchildren's love and care and not about THEIR egos!!!!!!! I doubt I will use this message board again as I find it not very helpfull only people taking sides regarding peoples lives from an edited glimpse of one hour. That could hardly put anyone in the expert chair to tell anyone what they should or should not be doing as I said earlier.

There is obviously no point in trying to discuss anything with you as you are correct about everything even when you don't know all the facts. First fact I believe I have only posted approx. 3 times which can hardly point to a pattern in any direction: Case in point---you stated I only told my side of the picture-not true. Children were present together with me at the therapist as I told them I was sorry things were not perfect in their childhood and hoped we could start from there as adults as I was a single parent raising them without much help and did make mistakes and unfortunately would continue to however, not the same ones twice. NOTE: therapist could hear with her own ears directly from all of us EXACTLY what each of us said or did not say and it was not a story I told or retold. Second incorrect fact you mentioned was that my husband/and or friends I indicated in my post were ACTUALLY present during the conversations in question and could also hear with their own ears what was said or not said. So to address the fact you erronously purported is not a story I am compelled to tell everyone and force them to agree with me. My husband states they are spoiled brats period. I don't necessarily agree with him but believe everyone one is entitled to their own opinion even you. I am extremely sorry more than you could ever know that I did not have all the information available to me from television, books, internet and studies that had not been done when I raised my children that are available to MOST people now. I did the best I could then as I do now (however I am more aware of numerous things I could have done differently then and do differently now if given the opportunity). Saying:"live and learn". I have and HAVE learned that to put my thoughts on the internet without explaining every possible scenero from each persons point of view  was and is a mistake. One that I won't be making again. FYI it take two to make a relationship work or not work. Having been in a successfull marriage for over 21 years I feel and think I must have learned something from living my life with the occasional mistake as I am just human as we all are. Does it stop me from trying to do better no! Will I never make another mistake or poor choice (informed or not informed) no! I can only do the best I can with what I have and pray knowing God will take care of the rest. The friends I have had the longest agree with me on some things and disagree with me or others as it should be. Does it make us any less

friends absoutely not if anything it makes us better friends knowing that each of us always speaks our own truth as we know it and don't just agree with the other person to never disagee with them or ALWAYS agree with either way you want to say that. In closing I am probably making a mistake by telling you this but will take the chance to attempt to get you to see that I actually do have my childrens and grandchildren's best interest at heart. I emailed the Dr. Phil show regards the current situation with my children and grandchildren and ask for advice to bridge the gap. To my surprise one of their staff  responded and ask if I would be interested in being on the show (a fact you can actually ck for yourself).

After some discussion and thought, I told them I felt (knowing my children as I do- and the producers not knowing them at all) that to ask them to be on the show and be exposed to the critical eye of the public was not fair to them even though I really wanted to have the opportunity to rekindle a relationship with them. I welcome constructive criticisim  as it is meant to help you (meaning anyone it is directly at). I personally have been helped by that. However, to ask this of someone that does not respond to constructive information be it well intentioned or not while we are in the midst of a family problem would not in anyway promote any reconsiliation of any form. It is not my intent to cause harm nor ever control only to attempt peace and harmony (knowing full well this is not possible at all times as we are only human). If you are familiar with the story in the bible regarding the dispute with the two mothers over the child and the decison to split the child in half, the actual true biological mother that loved her child said no give the child to the other mother as she did not want her child harmed. Lesson as I believe and most others do: we try and protect those we love. A further note from me as a mother-I have tried to protect them whether it hurts me or not in the process and have had to allow them to make their own mistakes and let them learn from them as some times most people will not learn from your mistakes by sharing them and can only learn when they make them on their own. This was intended as a learning tool for both me as the speaker (trying to better explain myself with words as I have had problems with this in the past and now as a person with a limitations due to health issues /not a victim of anything just a fact) and particularly you or anyone that happens to read this. The choice to stop prior to speaking/and or writing to consider you never have all the facts often just due to time constraints. To quote someone you just might be quite familiar with Dr. Phil,"there is your side and their side and the actual somewhere in between" or something to that effect as I don't believe that is the actual quote. Lastly I must say that my husband, children and anyone that has known me over a month or two realizes that I specifically try to repeat the actual specific word and even the tone the person and myself use as I repeat the conversation and even laugh at the degree of earnest with which I ATTEMPT to even get the TONE correct as the TONE can change the meaning of a single word or entire sentence. I hope this may be of help to you or others  as it has  been an opportunity for me to attempt to try to explain the facts with more understanding and success with ATTEMPT being the opporative word. I would apprecate you keeping any further thoughts to yourself as I believe it would not be productive to either of us and I am currently tryiing to stay just in the moment of NOW. Not in the past nor in the future. I am currently attempting to be happy with my present situation knowing that only God can change anything or anyone. Good luck and have a blessed day.