Cougar Crazy: Kat

"My friends are not getting that younger men don't have the baggage. When they get older, they do get set in their ways and cannot do anything spontaneous," says Kat, 51.


Her friend, Nancy, is bothered by Kat's dating habits. "She tells me older men just don't like sex. They have potbellies, and they're not interested in having fun. She dates much

younger men because older men will have child payments, will have to spend the holidays with their kids rather than her," she says. "The young boys, they're getting sex, and they're getting taken care of. They get some money."


"She thinks that I'm dating down. She thinks that I could do better. I love the guys I go out with, and I have a great time," Kat says.

"Kat and I dated for just over a year. It was a wonderful relationship. It was fantastic sex," says Ryon, Kat's 23-year-old ex-boyfriend. "Kat would buy me some things, so if I didn't have the money to repay her for that, I would work around her home."

Nancy believes Kat that was a sugar mama to some of her youthful paramours. "She's paid for flights. The one [relationship] previous to that, she paid his rent. I just think she's lost," she says.

"I don't really care that she feels that way. I'm happy. I'm living my life," Kat says.

Ryon explains why he ended his relationship with Kat. "I didn't feel that I was giving her the same emotional attention she was giving me during the end of the relationship," he says.

"But you have an emotional intelligence of zero " according to [Nancy] " so how would you know?" Dr. Phil jokes.


He turns to Nancy. "Are you being a little harsh on Ryon?"

"Perhaps that was a little harsh, but honestly, it's a very strange kind of relationship."

Dr. Phil observes that although Kat and Ryon have broken up, they're still holding hands. "Were you OK with ending this?" he asks Kat.

"Yes and no. I'd hoped we would be able to work through our differences. The relationship lasted over a year, and we actually lived together for a year, so it was a little bit more intense than just dating," she responds.

"Are you stereotyping people? Because you say men your age are rigid, inflexible, potbellied with low libido. Now, I'm six years older than you, and I take offense to that, woman!" Dr. Phil tells Kat with mock indignance. Standing, he pulls back his jacket. "I don't have a pot belly, and I, frankly, think I'm as flexible as a rubber hose."

When Robin hides her face in embarrassment, Dr. Phil clarifies. "I'm spontaneous. I'm willing to do things."

"It's not necessarily about age. It's about energy. If somebody my age came along and they were fun, and they were energetic, I would date them," Kat explains.

"I don't think that chronological age is necessarily a deal-breaker at all between two people, depending on their mindset, depending on why you're doing it, what you want and where you think it's going," Dr. Phil says.


Dr. Phil turns to Nancy. "You think that there is a money motive," he says. 

"I think part of it is a money motive. I think part of the mindset with Ryon too " if you get to know him a little bit more " he thinks women are disposable. Kat was never the only woman in his life," Nancy replies.

"You had other physical, sexual relationships while you were dating her?" Dr. Phil asks Ryon.

"Yes, that's right," Ryon says.

"Did that bother you?" Dr. Phil asks Kat.

"No, it did not. We had an open relationship."


"Is there a threshold you would have been bothered?" Dr. Phil asks.

"Yes, eventually," she replies. "If he wasn't honest with me about what he was doing. To this day, there are no secrets between us about anything that either of us are doing."

Kat explains why she sometimes conceals her real age. "In the past, some relationships that I had, when men found out how old I am, it was a huge issue for them. There's just such a stigma attached to older women dating younger men, and there's definitely a stigma attached to somebody who is 49, 50, 51," she says.

"You asked [Ryon] to lie about his age and tell people he was 25. Were you just afraid of being judged?" Dr. Phil inquires.

"Absolutely, by family and friends. It is a huge issue, and they do judge. When people think I'm 41, it's fine. When they find out I'm 51, it's not fine."

"Chronological age between two people, if they really meet each other's needs in every possible way, certainly companionship, and intellectually, emotionally, physically " all of that " it doesn't matter, depending on why you're doing it," Dr. Phil makes clear. "In your relationship with Ryon, are you looking for a life partner to grow old with, or somebody to have fun in the moment? Because the difference between you two at 23 and 50 is not near as big as the difference between you two at 33 and 60, or 43 and 70. That gap widens."

"When Ryon and I started dating, Ryon was very successful in his job, very well set up in his savings, and I thought to myself, this is a man who's come across my path who is young, who actually has all of these things together. I didn't think we'd be lifelong partners for 40 years, but what relationship lasts for 40 years anymore?"

Dr. Phil raises his hand.

"I don't have a problem with Kat dating younger men. That's not the issue. The issue is these are not what I would say are ‘quality men,'" Nancy clarifies. "She doesn't want to date an older man because he has baggage, but I'm looking at these younger men, and I think they have even more baggage."

Dr. Phil turns to Kat. "She thinks you support these guys, and you say it's not true," he says.

"With Ryon, it's absolutely not true," Kat says.

"She dared me to ask you if you're paying his expenses," Dr. Phil says.


"I'm not paying his expenses," Kat says. "When we were first together, and Ryon was working, and making great money, he absolutely paid for everything. I did not pay for a thing. When he lost his job and we were living together, Ryon would not do anything or go anywhere because he didn't have the money. I still wanted to go out, so yes, I did pay for a few of those things. But when Ryon gets back working again, he will pay for me. He has always wanted to be the man in the relationship and pay. Besides that, why should it make a difference? When a man pays for a woman, it's perfectly acceptable. Why shouldn't a woman be able to pay for a man? Why is it unacceptable by society?"

"Oh, I like that idea," Dr. Phil says.

"Nancy has her own opinion. I have my opinion. I totally disagree with Nancy. It's my life. I'm living it to the fullest," Kat says. "Ryon and I met almost by accident. I have never approached a younger man. It seems like younger men approach me."

"You say, ‘Younger men think I'm hot, sexy, and have great breasts, and they can never stop telling me that,'" Dr. Phil reads. He turns to Ryon. "Is this your first older woman?"

"I don't even look at the older part in the whole relationship. I'm dating a woman. The ‘older' is just a label," replies Ryon.

"Yeah, but you are old enough to be his mother," Dr. Phil tells Kat.

"When we're together, Kat doesn't act like my mother. She acts like a 24-year-old girl," Ryon says.

"That's a relief. She doesn't cut your meat," Dr. Phil jokes.

Nancy interjects, "Actually, Dr. Phil, that's not true. I've been honest with Kat, and I've told her this. When I've observed them in her house, [she says] " ‘This is how you're going to eat.' ‘This is how you're going to dress.' ‘Please change now,' so I do think there is that kind of interaction."

Gail, the previous guest, points out dating double standards. "The truth of the matter is, most men 52 look for a 28-year-old. Most men 44 look for a 28-year-old, and sometimes I do ask what is a woman supposed to do?" she asks.