Anna is being charged with abuse and neglect. "When I asked her the hard questions about how she was treating the six kids she already had, she consistently denied getting out of hand," Dr. Phil says.
"A lot. We decided to set up the cameras in the home, of
course," Anna responds.
"Do you watch the Dr. Phil show?"
"You don't know much about me," Dr. Phil says. "What I'm known for is cutting to the chase. People who come to me come to me because they want to change something."
"I asked you several questions when you were here before, and you said that you lied to me because I caught you off guard."
"I never lied to you."
Dr. Phil is exasperated. "OK, I think we're done here," he says, preparing to rise.
"You asked me about hurting my children, Dr. Phil. Are you
going to just give up on me and not hear me out?" Anna pleads.
"Yes, I am going to give up on you, because you are not telling me the truth yet. You are wasting my time," Dr. Phil says sternly.
"I asked you if you yelled at your children. I asked you if you were brutal with your children," Dr. Phil says.
"Yes, I do yell at them."
"You said, â€˜No, no, no. In fact, I'm a pushover.'"
They watch footage from Anna's first visit to the show. On tape, she says, "I think I'm too lenient. I have a really hard time disciplining my kids."
After the tape ends, Dr. Phil says, "I was pleading with you then. I said, â€˜If you have a problem, tell me, and I will help you with it.'"
"You daughter tells us that, after the show, you got on her
because she made you look bad by hesitating to answer that question [about corporal punishment]," Dr. Phil points out.
"I have 11 children," she replies.
"And you're thinking about having another child?" Dr. Phil asks, incredulously.
"My husband would like to have one because we have one together."
"Would you actually think about having another child?" Dr. Phil reiterates.
"Yes, I love babies."
Dr. Phil instructs Anna to watch footage captured by the home cams in her house.
"I wish you guys would just grow up and get out of my house," Anna says on tape. "Pack and go. Hit the * road!"
The videotape shows Anna struggling with her daughter and appearing to strike the teen. At her boiling point, the mom says, "These * cameras. I'm not filming my house. I want every * one of them out of here!"
The next morning, a contrite Anna sits in front of the camera. "I don't know if the video is still recording. I don't know where my kids are right now. I'm so sorry for everything " for losing my temper and getting upset. I just pray to God that Dr. Phil helps my family through this. We need to get help."
"I lost control," Anna admits as soon as the videotape ends.
"I didn't put those cameras in there for you to turn them off," Dr. Phil reprimands her. "We really don't know what happened when you turned it off, do we?"
"No, but Hannah will tell you. All of them will tell you."
"Did you or did you not mislead me when you were on the show?" Dr. Phil inquires.
"I didn't mean to, but I guess I did," Anna admits.
"If that's what you did when the cameras were on, doesn't that make you think I would wonder what you do when they're off?"
"Do you use corporal punishment with these children? You hit them, you choke them, you grab them, you spank them, you pull their hair."
"I never realized it ""
"What do you mean you didn't realize it was that bad? Do you have a memory problem?"
"Maybe I do. This opened my eyes up a lot," Anna says.
"You've got some monsters here. You created them. They have learned what they have lived. You have modeled lack of control, rage, rebellion, defiance. They have learned it well," Dr. Phil says.
"I don't know how to control them. I'll admit I need help. I need counseling," Anna says, voice breaking. "I love my kids, but I'm screwing up badly."
"I'm abusing them emotionally," Anna says. "I was very abused in that cult. I think the biggest mistake I made in my entire life is when I got out of that cult, I should have stayed in counseling with my family."
"Do you think that the right thing to do is to get those four kids out of this sect or cult, as you call it, and bring them back to you?"
Dr. Phil says that Anna's kids are doomed to repeat their parental legacy of abuse. "They've learned it, and that will be their legacy with their children, unless you stand up and give them a different model," he says.
"I don't know how to do it," she says tearfully.
"You're a smart lady. You can do this, but you have to be brutally honest. The first sentence you need to say is, â€˜I am an out-of-control, rageaholic mother, and I've lost my kids, and I need to get under control.' That's where you start. You're not an evil person," Dr. Phil says. "When I see that kind of rage, I look past the rage, and what I see is pain."
Anna turns her face, sobbing.
They shake on it, and Dr. Phil gives Anna a hug.