In late September 2019, Tylee Ryan, 17, and her 7-year-old brother, Joshua “JJ” Valow, disappeared. Their mother, Lori Vallow, refuses to tell anyone where her children are and refuses to cooperate with police.

In his podcast series Mystery and Murder: Analysis by Dr. Phil, Dr. Phil explores the mysterious disappearance. In episode 2, Dr. Phil discusses Lori’s strange behavior leading up to the children’s disappearance, and what the grandparents say they think happened to their missing grandson. Plus, Dr. Phil analyzes the signs of pathological liars, parents who allegedly kill, and the importance of autopsies.

This episode is available now. Listen and subscribe here.